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Steve961
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# Posted: 1 Feb 2016 12:33pm
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If what I see is correct, and Washington DC is under water, how can this be a bad thing?
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 1 Feb 2016 01:49pm
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We don't agree about everything Toyota, but I agree with your choice of UTV. I'm jealous, and I have to do a lot of other work before I'll be able to think about getting one of those. Oh well.
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azgreg
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2016 10:47am
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http://www.latimes.com/science/sciencenow/la-sci-sn-water-land-gravity-sea-level-2016 0215-story.html
Despite the accelerated melting of glaciers and ice sheets, sea levels aren't rising quite as quickly as scientists anticipated. The reason: Continents are absorbing more of the water before it flows into the seas, according to a new study.
Scientists at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory figured this out by measuring changes in Earth's gravity with twin satellites orbiting the Earth in tandem. Over the past decade, thirsty continents have slowed the rate of sea level rise by about 20%, or about 1 millimeter per year, according to the study published in Science.
The force of gravity depends on mass: The more there is, the stronger the gravitational attraction. And on Earth, the only thing heavy enough and mobile enough to affect the planet's gravity is water, said John T. Reager, a JPL hydrologist and the study's lead author.
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old greybeard
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2016 12:46pm
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I use AC at home 5 days a year, in a humid mid atlantic area. I drive a small car, and don't use AC. I spend 140 days a year at a cabin with solar power, spring water. I grow most of my own vegetables and kill my own natural red meat. I imagine most of us on this site have a small footprint. Let me know when those who want to tax us to death decide to join us living simple then I'll get on board. The Obama's and Gore living in their mansions and flying private jets need to lead by example. If you believe the rich and powerful will change their lifestyles one iota you're crazy. They and China, the biggest emitter, have no plans to change. Pollution and stupidity will do in civilization way before warming will!
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shall
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2016 01:33pm
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The politicians' answer to every "problem" is more of your money and more of your freedoms.
AFA a campaign costing millions by the Koch Brothers, one should consider the 24/7 propaganda by the other side which I'm quite certain dwarfs any propaganda campaign that a couple of brothers could embark on.
Also consider how scientists who disagree with the prevailing view of those rewarded with endless government grants are silenced, blackballed and defunded.
and finally, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuj_tlRRQdQ
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creeky
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2016 07:27pm
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Quoting: azgreg Scientists at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory figured this out by measuring changes in Earth's gravity with twin satellites orbiting the Earth in tandem
don't ya love science. you know. freaky cool stuff like tandem satellites and gravity monitors.
sure beats, from back in the day, counting birds and monitoring birch tree latitudes.
boy. that science. protecting us from acid rain (neat article). remember that? and ozone thinning. and now CO2 rises.
lucky we have scientists doing all this science.
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Ontario lakeside
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2016 08:09pm
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Say, I sure like that internet the Scientists came up with! 
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2016 11:29pm
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I knew a guy who just loved that medical science had given him statins so he could eat all the steak and triple cheese enchiladas he wanted to and not risk heart disease. He was at least 100 lbs overweight.
But when those pesky scientists told him burning gasoline was a problem, all of a sudden those scientists were a bunch of liars.
Who was it that said, "All is vanity"?
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2016 11:31pm
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Quoting: Ontario lakeside Say, I sure like that internet the Scientists came up with!
And they also invented Spam! I mean the real stuff in a can!
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SE Ohio
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# Posted: 17 Feb 2016 05:00pm
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Scientists aren't always right. A few years ago medical science said that the stomach was too acidic an environment for germs to survive, and ulcers were caused by stress. Recommendation was to change diet and reduce stress. Later it was found that most ulcers were caused by a germ!
Also there were safe food contact materials, FDA approved and scientist approved, that have been found unsafe by other scientists, think Bpa and certain PVC plasticizers that have been discussed here before.
Every year it seems something else has been disproved or recalled, pitting new science versus old science.
Now we have scientists that cannot predict the weather next month or even tomorrow accurately telling us what to expect in years to come, some of these predictions for well after we're all gone... When I was in grade school, we were told if the ice caps all melted the whole earth would be flooded with only a few mountains sticking out! I've read many predictions now and no two seem to agree. Heck, one prediction I read was that global warming will bring on a new ice age (gulf stream disrupted, etc. I'm still trying to figure that one out). I don't know which scientist to believe.
The earth has been hotter and colder long before mankind. We might be changing the climate, and Mother Nature have ways of taking charge. I guess I'll have to stick around a while and see what happens!
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Ontario lakeside
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# Posted: 17 Feb 2016 07:57pm
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The Beautiful thing about scientists is that they love to be proven wrong. Finding an error takes you one step closer to the truth. Of course scientists are people and subject to greed and corruption and therefor there research as well.
But Science in its pure quest for the truth is one of humanities great triumphs.
If you question the results, Great! But check your motives.
If you have minute have listen to one the greatest scientists.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYPapE-3FRw
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ILFE
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 12:04pm
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http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamestaylor/2015/05/19/updated-nasa-data-polar-ice-not-re ceding-after-all/
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 01:41pm - Edited by: bldginsp
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https://www.atmos.illinois.edu/~wlchapma/Forbes.article.response.pdf
One thing Taylor said really bugs me:
"In and of themselves, receding polar ice caps have little if any negative impact on human health and welfare, and likely a positive benefit by opening up previously ice-entombed land to human, animal, and plant life."
The farmlands of Bangladesh and other coastal areas have already begun to experience salt water intrusion and loss of land, with only about 6" sea level rise over the last 100 years. Islands in the South Pacific are becoming uninhabitable. The negative impact will be tremendous and cause great suffering if it continues. This disregard for human life is frightening.
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 02:40pm - Edited by: bldginsp
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Forbes seems willing to print opposing views:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesconca/2015/06/15/a-pause-in-global-warming-not-reall y/#6152e1f5c227
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesconca/2014/11/14/does-our-military-know-something-we -dont-about-global-warming/#19bf985a1f23
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 03:42pm
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So until the last 15 years, the earths temp has been rock solid steady, right?
http://www.climatedepot.com/
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 04:51pm - Edited by: MtnDon
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... 
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 08:12pm - Edited by: bldginsp
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Toyota- a quick search shows that "Climate Depot" is produced by CFACT, an organization created to funnel anonymous money for the purpose of influencing the climate debate. As Exxon and the Koch brothers have been criticized for spending millions of dollars on 'information' about global warming, they have spent less and less, but mysteriously these organizations like CFACT have popped up which do not reveal their money sources, then they funnel the money to global warming denial efforts. This organization is getting huge amounts of money- hundreds of millions. I believe that Climate Depot is oil industry propaganda.
http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/02/28/how-the-dirty-energy-money-funding-climate-in ac/192829
LOTS of money is being spent by vested interests to push the global warming denial agenda. I suggest that everyone research sources whenever getting any information on the subject. Do you trust the Koch brothers and Exxon?
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 10:12pm - Edited by: toyota_mdt_tech
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LOTS of money is being spent by vested interests to push the global warming agenda. I suggest that everyone research sources whenever getting any information on the subject. Do you trust the federal govt? Keep in mind, its a tax on energy they want. mfg a crisis, than charge you to fix it. Do you trust
I wish you would look deeper into who funds the warm mongers websites. I have, it will surprise you.
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2014/07/30/shock-us-senate-minority-report/
If you think there is not huge money for global warming, you are highly mistaken.
Koch and Exxon do not extort money from me, they do not force me to buy anything they have, the govt on the other hand uses the point of a gun and imprisonment to confiscate my wealth.
If a lobbyist does influence a politician, then the politician is the person you should be questioning.
Do you really think the life giving carbon dioxide is a pollutant? It actually protects us from freezing to death.
Anyway, my last question went unanswered. You think the earth temps has remain flat and only the last 15 years, fluctuated?
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 10:19pm
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Quoting: bldginsp One thing Taylor said really bugs me: "In and of themselves, receding polar ice caps have little if any negative impact on human health and welfare, and likely a positive benefit by opening up previously ice-entombed land to human, animal, and plant life."
What has been happening at the south pole? Why is it so much colder?
Antarctic Sea Ice Reaches New Record Maximum http://www.nasa.gov/content/goddard/antarctic-sea-ice-reaches-new-record-maximum
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 10:26pm - Edited by: toyota_mdt_tech
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Quoting: bldginsp Toyota- a quick search shows that "Climate Depot"
A quick search for media matters (your source) is
http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/printgroupProfile.asp?grpid=7150
Self-described "progressive" media "monitor" that tracks "conservative misinformation"
A creation of Democratic Party funders and ofperatives, and of former conservative writer David Brock
Dictates the content of many mainstream media reports
Smears conservatives as liars and racists
Contends that conservatives dominate the mainstream media
Is funded and supported by the billionaire philanthropist George Soros
Has regular contact and strategy sessions with political operatives inside the Obama White House
Has collaborated with Attorney General Eric Holder's office in an effort to discredit and suppress news stories about scandals plaguing the Justice Department
Whois.net shows its registered out of Washington DC, huh, suspicious, isnt it?
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 10:58pm
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Rdkng07
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# Posted: 24 Feb 2016 11:04pm
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At Toyota....
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 25 Feb 2016 01:48am
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Quoting: bldginsp ... image.gif image.gif image.gif image.gif
 
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RichInTheUSA
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# Posted: 25 Feb 2016 06:54am
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How can the earth have periodic ice ages every 100 thousand years if it's only 6,000 years old to begin with?
The funniest thing about reading this thread was that it was posted in "Useful Links and Resources".
Uhh... I don't think so. But it was entertaining!
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old greybeard
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# Posted: 25 Feb 2016 07:09am
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We all agree pollution is horrible. Yet look at the numbers that China produces. Google the amount of plastic that China and the far east put into the oceans every year. And China is by far the biggest greenhouse contributor.
Yet our Gov't has given them a 10 year pass on reducing emissions. Meanwhile their underpaid workers flood our shores with junk we don't need. And with items we could make ourselves with proper environmental protections and worker rights.
The same people who want to tax us for our greenhouse outputs support China's right to destroy the earth. As long as they get rich.
Don't fall for the propaganda.
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 25 Feb 2016 08:54am
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OK, I'm good with the horse being dead.
But I didnt rekindle this thread with loads of post, then after rebuttals/replys, post the deadhorse.gif as if I was an innocent bystander on the sidelines just observing the mayhem.
OK, horse is long dead, I'm good with that (actually, I love horses) and I am just a few months from my spring thaw/cabin run. Big trip, installing new home made woodstove, first time with my new Kawasaki Mule, its going to be a fun time. I think painting is in my near future too. Weather over there is hard on anything. Cold winters, real warms summers, not lots of rain. The sun is the hardest. Probably worse with all the warming... 
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 25 Feb 2016 10:48am - Edited by: MtnDon
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Note: the "flogging a dead horse" was not and is not directed at any one person. It is directed at the subject. We will not know whether or not any of the current beliefs or theories on climate are valid until a hundred years or more pass by........ And unfortunately, like our current political situation here in the USA, climate change discussions simply seem to get more polarized as they progress.
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 25 Feb 2016 02:41pm - Edited by: toyota_mdt_tech
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Ice ages last about 1,000,000 years and warming cycle last about 80,000 years on average (regardless of big oil or Koch Bros). We are near the end of the warming cycle, so you guys had better enjoy it, you wont like the cooling at all compared to the warming.
So if you have a cabin, enjoy it. If your building one, get going. From history, mine will be ground to sawdust by massive moving ice next cycle. Probably tear out all my trees and fence. Oh well, next guy can deal with it, maybe find some old artifacts. I know my woodstove will be someone still intact. I really overbuilt that think.
Don. I know the horse was the topic, not a person.
OK, converted this to fun thread.
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