|
| Author |
Message |
FishHog
Member
|
# Posted: 16 Jun 2015 11:45am
Reply
We bougth a new cottage last year. Haven't worried about selling the old one as we wanted to finish our renovations before we moved. Completely off the grid, so the only cost is the taxes where are pretty low, so it wasn't a priority.
A family on the lake approached me about selling. Told them I'll let them know when I ready. They keep bugging me so I finally threw them a number to see if they were really serious. They agreed, but understandably want it sooner rather than later.
Long story short, with such a simple transaction between friends. Do I need a lawyer to sell. They are using one to do the land registry transfer which I agree with, but can't I just sign the paperwork and take the chq, and hand them the key. My lawyer threw me a flat rate which is crazy (tells me its for my protection), but I'm not seeing the risk.
Anyone done it?
Thanks,
FishHog
|
|
bldginsp
Member
|
# Posted: 16 Jun 2015 03:13pm
Reply
Never done it, wouldn't. If for any reason after the fact they want out of the deal, and you have no contract, you're at their mercy. Is there a cheaper lawyer? Have you researched books on selling yourself, or local agencies that help? Do they have Help-You-Sell where you are?
|
|
FishHog
Member
|
# Posted: 16 Jun 2015 03:32pm
Reply
Well I have a offer of sale, which we all signed and agreed to. So once I get the money, how can they back out?
I kind of assumed their lawyer would do up the paperwork and I'd go in and sign it off. I don't see what my lawyer brings to the table. I'll do some research, this was the first place I thought I might get some practical information as opposed to the standard lawyer (give us your money its for your own good) story.
thanks
|
|
Littlecooner
Member
|
# Posted: 16 Jun 2015 03:39pm
Reply
You are in Canada and I am in the US of A. So, do not understand your real estate laws. Here. that is done quite often. Once carried a casher's check to a man's house, several hours and a state away, gave him a deed I had written, he signed, I notarized his signature, handed him the check and drove back home, the proud owner of 60 acres of fine timberland with timber. About 10 years ago, met a man at a McDonald's, signed the deed he gave me and he handed me a very large check for 40 acres of timberland. The deed went to one of the largest corporations in the Southeastern United States, which is who the check was from. Girl at the drive in teller went nuts when I tried to deposit it to checking account the next day, I had to go see the bank president to make the deposit. Nope, here, you do not need anyone, You sign the deed and they hand you money, deal is immediate. If you trust the check (ask for cashier check) then what do you need to pay an attorney a lot of money to sit at a table and watch you sign your name and reach for a check? If you sign even just a hand written agreement that he is buying the property "as is, where is" and you get the signatures witnessed, where is the risk?
|
|
Steve_S
Member
|
# Posted: 16 Jun 2015 03:40pm
Reply
A simple transaction of that sort in our province would not cost more than $800. Land Transfer taxes, land registry clearances, deeds registrations and such are a pain and unless you know how to do all that, a RE Lawyer is simple enough and little hassle.
I have bought & sold a fair bit of land over the years, from farms, condo's houses & townhouses etc... The hassles & surprises that can pop up can make your hair fallout overnight. Then we have these new Government Regs from the Harper Regime on financial transactions and such... OK RANT POTENTIAL - ENDING LINE OF THOUGHT. *&(^#*()^&)_*(&@#
Consider the cost of 800 well worth the Sanity Value and making sure that nothing pops out at you a year or two later cause something was missed or wrongly filed.
|
|
Steve_S
Member
|
# Posted: 16 Jun 2015 03:45pm
Reply
RE Laws & Regs in Canada are significantly different than in the States. More hoops & loops to jump through. YES you ca do it on your own without a lawyer, but IF things get messed up (dotting i's & crossing t's) you're the one holding the rotting bag of hammers.
|
|
Littlecooner
Member
|
# Posted: 16 Jun 2015 03:53pm
Reply
Fish hog, that will be $ 500 for advice. where do I send my bill. (Learned that trick from Attorneys), I have been working with them for 40+ years and have some great close friends who are attorneys.
|
|
FishHog
Member
|
# Posted: 16 Jun 2015 09:01pm
Reply
Quoting: Littlecooner Fish hog, that will be $ 500 for advice
exactly what I'm trying to avoid. 
thanks for info guys. Good food for thought..
|
|
|
soundandfurycabin
Member
|
# Posted: 16 Jun 2015 09:44pm
Reply
My thought is that the risk is much greater for the purchaser -- verifying the property description, checking covenants and charges, making sure there are no outstanding liens or mortgages, etc.
As the seller, if you don't have any mortgage to pay out, then you just have to make sure the payment comes through. Since the buyer is using a lawyer, the funds will probably go through the lawyer's trust account. The buyer will deposit money into the lawyer's trust account, the lawyer will transfer the title and then pay you. If you feel you need further protection, a notary would be able to handle such a simple transaction for less than a lawyer's fee.
|
|
FishHog
Member
|
# Posted: 17 Jun 2015 07:29am
Reply
I feel the same way soundandfurycabin. And the purchaser is a long term family friend who will personally hand me the money, so I'm not seeing where my risk is.
Seems like a money grab to me, but maybe I'll just conform. Resistance is futile at times.
|
|
Littlecooner
Member
|
# Posted: 17 Jun 2015 09:01am
Reply
soundandfurycabin is correct, the burden is on the buyer and his attorney to make sure things are correct. Its the buyers problem if something "falls thru the crack" and is not done correctly. I am sure his attorney will discuss property tax fees, recording fees, checking the legal description to make sure it is correct, etc. And he is correct about the trust account to handle the funds. Even if you have a mortgage, it is the buyer who must ensure that is its paid in full at the time of the transfer. You have one attorney in the picture, paid for by your friend the purchases. I just do not see why you need one to just look over your shoulder when the other attorney is doing all the work. Its your money. Also be aware of this, I have lived in my state for 65 years and we are a "buyer beware" state. When you put down your money and obtain a deed, the property is yours, as is, where is and if something is incorrect, well, you should have done your homework and not put down your money. I love that idea in this day and age of "if I messed up, then its got to be some one else fault, let me get a lawyer and find a deep pocket of some one who did this evil thing to me" Hey, its just the internet and we all got opinions. This is no place for legal advice, but it is a good place to get the brain working on ideas from other people.
|
|
Steve_S
Member
|
# Posted: 17 Jun 2015 09:39am
Reply
I should have clarified a tad... As seller you really haven't that much to worry about, even less so as this is someone you know and their $ is good. But THEY (purchaser) is the one who has to make sure titles, deeds, surveys whatnot are in order and things are registered / transferred.
There is always Title Insurance they can get if they want but I've heard mixed tales on that. I had it only once on a property because there was no current survey and that house was built in the late 1800's so....
|
|
Kudzu
Member
|
# Posted: 18 Jun 2015 08:11am
Reply
T would think you would be OK to take the money and run, it is the purchaser that needs a lawyer, he is giving, not receiving money. Get a certified check and skip to the bank.
|
|
bldginsp
Member
|
# Posted: 18 Jun 2015 02:53pm
Reply
Yes the purchaser is taking most of the risk and has a greater need for an attorney. But what sometimes happens is the buyer wants out of the deal after they have paid the seller, so they sue for breach of contract, failure to disclose, whatever. Doesn't happen very often but when it does its a mess. Probably a pretty small risk, but if it happens a solid contract that protects you is often enough to get them to shut up.
|
|
Kudzu
Member
|
# Posted: 18 Jun 2015 08:09pm
Reply
What he/she said
|
|
TerraLove
Member
|
# Posted: 17 Feb 2017 10:29am
Reply
Not sure what "solid contract" you are referring to which a seller's lawyer would produce versus selling w/o a lawyer. The "solid contract" in my view is the standard offer of purchase and sale form (which you can download from OREA) with any attached conditions. There really is no difference in paperwork whether you are selling with or w/o a lawyer. Let me know if I am missing anything.
|
|
FishHog
Member
|
# Posted: 17 Feb 2017 04:21pm - Edited by: FishHog
Reply
Thread from the past. But what I learned in Ontario at least. Lawyers are mandatory to file the title change. That came into effect about 10 yrs ago. I tried to get around it in conjunction with the buyer. Then we tried with just one lawyer and still hit road blocks. Seems the lawyers had the rules changed so you have no choice. Asinine but true in Ontario.
|
|
Steve_S
Member
|
# Posted: 17 Feb 2017 04:51pm
Reply
Yup, gotta love the Upper Canada Law Society.... Hrumph...
|
|
|
