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carilchasens
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# Posted: 21 Nov 2018 01:24pm
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I may have to replace our old propane range which has an oven that lights manually. New units seem to require electricity... don't want that. Any suggestions?
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beachman
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# Posted: 21 Nov 2018 01:36pm
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We have the same issue and purchased a Peerless gas range several years ago from Ben's in Nevada. You might have luck with a local distributor. I too am in Canada and shipping can be expensive. The gas ranges that you normally see here have "glow plugs" that are a constant drain on electricity and no problem if on the grid. Our Peerless lights automatically with sparking units (no pilots) on the range and the oven. We have solar but I have seen units with battery compartments that appear to work well. There may be cheaper alternatives but we are pleased with our unit and before we hooked it up to the solar, we were able to light it manually.
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Steve961
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# Posted: 21 Nov 2018 01:39pm - Edited by: Steve961
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Premier makes gas ranges that use 8 AA batteries for ignition.
Premier Ranges
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ICC
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# Posted: 21 Nov 2018 02:16pm
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Peerless are quite good. If too costly then look for abare bones range with pilot light burners on the range top. Those usually also have a pilot light oven burner.
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fitzpatt
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# Posted: 21 Nov 2018 02:54pm
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I have heard great things about the Unique brand of off the grid appliances. I believe they are based in Ontario. I have seen them in person and they appear to be very well made. i eventually plan to purchase their range and direct vent propane fridge. Costco carries them in Canada as well.
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silverwaterlady
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# Posted: 21 Nov 2018 03:21pm
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Here is a stock photo of the Unique range I purchased this summer.
It uses one D size battery installed in the front of the stove in the removable bottom panel to light the pilots.
It is a wonderful stove. The front right burner is a turbo burner, the back right burner is a simmer burner (you will need it because the two left hand burners do not have a flame that will go low enough for a long time simmer).
The two left hand burners are regular burners.
The grate is made of cast iron in two pieces. It is a continuous burner so you can slide pots around.
The only issue I have with the stove is the oven. It does not set to the correct temperature on the dial. I have to set it about 25 degrees higher. I've always used a oven thermometer in all my ovens and most of them have been a little off.
Lighting the oven takes a little getting used to because you have to hold the dial in for about ten seconds. If you don't the pilot won't stay lit. Opening up the door on the broiler that is under the oven helps while lighting the pilot, it helps to see that the flame is on. If you plan on doing a lot of baking you can leave the pilot on. I did that a few times but could smell the fumes. That's in a closed cabin. I suppose if it was better weather and the windows were open the smell wouldn't be a issue. The fumes did not set off my co detector.
The oven bakes beautifully but quicker than my gas oven at home. I had to cut from 10-15 minutes off the bake time.
I baked a turkey, cakes, cookies, two pumpkin pies.
And a Dutch oven stew that cooked slowly for five hours. This stew I usually cook in a crock pot. Since we are off grid I've replaced my city crock pot with a heavy enamel coated iron Dutch oven.
It's a new way of cooking for me so I ordered a Dutch oven cookbook from Amazon.
I did use my crock pot recipe. It still came out delicious.
I highly recommend going the Dutch oven route to replace a crock pot in a off grid household. The stew meat melted in our mouths.
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rockies
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# Posted: 21 Nov 2018 09:24pm
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Fitzpatt: I did a comparison on the amount of propane it would cost to run a fridge over a year compared to having a very efficient electric fridge.
To run a propane fridge costs hundreds of dollars a year and will only get more expensive as fuel prices go up. If you're only using your fridge a few months a year or on weekends that might not mean much for you but year round a propane fridge is very expensive to operate.
Might I suggest using a chest freezer and converting it to a fridge using a temperature controller? That would be the easiest way to use the least amount of power, assuming of course that you have solar PV.
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Borrego
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# Posted: 21 Nov 2018 09:49pm
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Quoting: rockies To run a propane fridge costs hundreds of dollars a year and will only get more expensive as fuel prices go up. If you're only using your fridge a few months a year or on weekends that might not mean much for you but year round a propane fridge is very expensive to operate.
But to a real cook, using a gas range is the only way to go, cost be damned.....
We're not taking much $ anyway. And if you're going off-grid with solar, an electric stove not very smart..
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fitzpatt
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# Posted: 21 Nov 2018 10:42pm
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Thank you both. Something to consider.
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silverwaterlady
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# Posted: 21 Nov 2018 11:51pm
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I've spent time in Canada this time of year and let me tell you, it was cloudy every day this fall. If we had sun it was for a few minutes here and there.
Than it started to snow. A lot.
If one was relying on solar it would have to be a very huge array of panels with plenty of batteries.
Considering the cost to build and maintain a solar system the size it would take to run even a small (read running to the store every few days for groceries) energy efficient refridgerator, the cost of propane is small.
I ran my propane refrigerator on one 30 pounder for 30 days at a cost of $35. I can go 3-4 weeks before I need to travel 70 miles round trip for groceries.
I suppose it depends on your situation.
I'm actually saving money.
I'm very happy with my Unique refrigerator.
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creeky
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# Posted: 22 Nov 2018 10:50am
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35 x 12 x 8 = 3360
That's the amount of money I have saved on propane by using an electric fridge according to silverwaterlady. Thanks!
Then look at the price of the fridge. At costco Canada the 18 cu ft Unique is 4000. A fridgedaire electric in 18 cu ft is 799 at Home Hardware.
I now have 6500 dollars to spend on a solar system. That's a nice system. And the electricity will do all sorts of other great things. Using propane for refrigeration is not a great option for off grid.
There is virtually no maintenance on a properly constructed solar system today. You sweep the panels in the fall. If the weather gets really bad you run your genny for an hour here and there. Last year I ran my genny five times for charging.
And I never need to haul propane.
I also use an induction cooktop in the summer for cooking. Keeps my kitchen cooler.
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silverwaterlady
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# Posted: 22 Nov 2018 11:24am
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 Lol, creeky, YW.
As I said.
Each of us have different cabin living situations.
What works out well for me may not for somebody else.
Due to some privacy issues, I won't go into more detail.
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carilchasens
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# Posted: 22 Nov 2018 01:48pm
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Quoting: silverwaterlady the Unique range I purchased this summer.
Am considering a smaller Unique range. Happy to hear your experience. Question: Have you ever lit your oven manually, using a flame rather than the battery system? Most gas ovens nowadays can't be lit this way nowadays, because an interlock system prevents gas flow without electricity. Customer service at Unique tells me manual lighting will work with the smaller model range I asked them about.
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Borrego
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# Posted: 22 Nov 2018 04:28pm
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I have had a Premier (with the griddle!) for about a year now, and it has been wonderful. To carilchasens: at least with the Premier, it is in the manual that you can hand light the burners and oven if needed.
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silverwaterlady
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# Posted: 22 Nov 2018 04:49pm - Edited by: silverwaterlady
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carilchasens as Borrego states, yes one can light the pilots manually. No I did not try to do it because I didn't have to. Plus that is a little scary. But I could do it if I had to as I have other things in life.
If you get a smaller model range it will be the small rv/apartment size. This will mean that you cannot safely use regular size pots and pans. They will overlap the burners. If you decide to use a fry pan larger than a sauté pan you will have to continually move the pan around the burner to cook stuff. This is how I have to cook on my rv stove. You will also have to use smaller bakeware, because the space is limited in the oven things will not bake evenly. I gave up serious baking in my rv oven for this reason.
Borrego I wanted the griddle Premier range but unfortunately did not have 36" space for it because I bought that long farmhouse sink that I love and wanted some counter space next to my stove for my utensils and spices.
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rockies
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# Posted: 22 Nov 2018 07:35pm
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Propane is an excellent and logical choice for cooking, especially in an off-grid cabin. The amount of time the stove is using propane is not nearly as long as the amount of time a propane fridge is using propane (cycling on and off can be as much as 8 hrs a day of continual usage).
I have found upright fridges on the Govt Energy Star site that use about 320 kWh/yr and that seems reasonable.
Of course, you can always use a chest freezer and convert it into a fridge. That uses a lot less power.
https://www.newlifeonahomestead.com/convert-chest-freezer-to-fridge-solar/
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deercula
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# Posted: 22 Nov 2018 10:00pm - Edited by: deercula
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I have the Premier and could not say a bad thing about it. I got the natural gas model that comes with all the propane equipment installed. It takes less than an hour to convert to propane with a wrench and screwdriver. Very simple. The burner lights with either battery provided spark, or a match. Same for the oven. The oven pilot only needs lighting when you intend to use the oven. Have made everthing from turkey to pizza with no problems. Also, Premier has a cool accessory shelf that clips on to the cook top. It gives you a nice size shelf for a microwave, other cooking tools, spices, etc.
Link to use, care, and instruction manual:
https://www.premierrange.com/tutorials/Gas-Range-Use-&-Care-Manual-and-Installation-I nstructions.pdf
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Steve_S
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# Posted: 23 Nov 2018 06:30pm
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I have a Unique 24" Classic in Black & Stainless. Very Nice, simple easy stove, uses a "D" cell for power to ignite burner's, no pilots or glow bar... designed for off grid use. You should also note that the steel and finish is also thicker & heavier than most others out there and generally built tougher.
LINK: http://uniqueoffgrid.com/product/classic-24-off-grid-propane-range/
I previously had a Caloric Professional series, was a lovely stove but quite a pig and it had a glow bar so that's out of the question in the offgrid solar world.
Fridge... I have a Danby Energy Star 10 Cubic Foot "Apartment Size" fridge which uses 269kwh a year and works fine, plus it only cost $450 @ Costco. There are many versions & sizes plus with the Energy Star they use less juice. Mine is a couple of years old now & was replaced by this model below but look at the others... maybe available near you for a good price too.
https://www.danby.com/products/apartment-size-refrigerators/dff100c2bssdd/
Good Luck, Hope it helps.
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Borrego
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2018 10:49am
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I have that same fridge, and it is perfect for an off-grid cabin. Plenty of room and fairly quiet too.....
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creeky
Member
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2018 10:57am
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Quoting: silverwaterlady different cabin living situations
Ain't that the truth. I realize I'm fortunate to have a lot of privacy and mostly great neighbors where I am.
I have the MagicChef version of the Danby. 10 cu ft.
I bought a propane stove for 350 used. Its a GE. 5 burner. I leave it plugged in for the electric ignition. The glow bar doesn't worry me. I have lots of storage.
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Ontario lakeside
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2018 06:40pm
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I converted a used natural gas stove to propane. there are several models that come with the kit in the back. $50 on craigslist and you are good to go.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHNt5MzaZ-0&t=237s
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silverwaterlady
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2018 07:42pm
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Okay. I cannot get by on a little electric refridgerator.
No way!!!!
I make huge vats of soup and oatmeal.
I use a 20 quart stock pot!
I make enough food to last a few days.
I freeze some of it. My freezer is huge.
I double recipes.
I love to cook.
But I also love to be outside in nature.
I love to work in the bush all day. Building more walking trails. Inproving the road.
I got a chainsaw for my birthday.
So I do not have the time to cook every morning, noon and night.
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ICC
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2018 08:11pm - Edited by: ICC
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A large fridge can be run on a solar powered site. PV panels are amazingly cheap while propane fridges are amazingly expensive. That's what I see anyhow. I have lots of solar and storage and had many high efficiency fridges to choose from, not just a smattering of propane versions. Ten years ago propane was still king of off-grid refrigeration. The king has been overthrown.
Look at LG or Samsung. Any withbthe 10 year compressor warranty use the highly efficient inverter compressor technology. Maybe other brands too, but when I was looking LG and Samsung were the main players available to me. 30 cu. ft. Sizes available.
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creeky
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2018 08:26pm
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Large fridges are basically the same power use as smaller ones. I've seen 18 cu ft at 348 kwh. Vs 311 on my 10 cu ft. It's just that I bought my fridge before lithium batteries.
Buying today I would definitely go bigger.
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silverwaterlady
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# Posted: 25 Nov 2018 02:01pm
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I know that propane refridgerators are expensive. That's why I went 35 years at camp without one.
I used block ice if I went to town or cubes I could buy at a little restaurant nearby.
There is one very important reason to me why I did not want a electric refridgerator.
It is so quiet at camp. I did not want to hear the sound of a compressor.
I want to hear nature. No man made noises.
I even had to remove a battery from a clock because I could hear it ticking throughout the cabin.
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