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Julie2Oregon
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# Posted: 12 Dec 2016 11:29pm
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Seriously. I'm not loving the wood stove experience. Not one bit. It's too NEEDY, like managing a toddler 24/7. On my infrequent trips to town, which last several hours, I dread having to come home and coax a fire out of her. Middle of the night feedings. And days like today when I'm working on projects but have to stop and check her status. It delays progress.
Any tips or advice? I know I'll be putting a pellet stove in the main cabin now.
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DaveBell
Moderator
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 02:31am
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You should be able to build a fire, let it burn down so you have coals, load it again, then damp it down on the stove and the flue so it burns all night. Post a bunch a pics and lets see what you have.
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sparky30_06
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 06:40am
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Welcome to cabin life with a wood burning stove. Growing up we heated our house with wood in northern Illinois. Cut, split and stack all summer then bring wood in everyday through the snow. stoke the fire all day long. load it up at night to wake up to a chilly house and only a few coals in the morning. Stoke the fire back up in the morning and repeat.
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FishHog
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 08:28am
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good dry wood would sure help you out Julie. I know you have issues with that. Poor wood makes for poor fires. You obviously didn't have time to get good wood, but might be worth buying a load to get you by this year.
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 08:52am
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Julie, I think a pellet stove would be perfect. It requires power for the feeder. Soem feeders use 110VAC, look for one thta uses low voltage like 12V, then have it hooked to a solar charger and also charge when the generator si running too. Hey, a pellet stove in your home, you will already have it on hand. They are pretty efficient. They produce little to no smoke either and on those days when you are sick in bed, be nice not to have to tend to a fine.
Look for EPA certified. It will cost a bit of $$$ but it will end up in the home, so a good investment.
Do you have your power pole in place or not hooked to the grid yet?
In the mean time, pile wood inside and as you take from that dry pile, replenish it each time so you always have dry wood on hand.
Imagine what the early pioneers went through. I think about that often, cutting wood all by hand saw too. We have it pretty easy.
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Just
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 09:59am
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Buy a armful of dry hardwood and try it..
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 10:21am
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Yes, if the wood you are using does not have a nice hollow sound when you strike two pieces together it may not be dry enough. Damp or wet wood makes any stove appear to be inferior.
There are other variables too. Our stove has a thermostat air inlet control. That makes a world of difference. We love ours.
Also, how well insulated is the building? That too makes a world of difference in comfort and how much wood is burned.
If you do go to a pellet stove would you consider propane? Or is transporting small tanks too much hassle? Able to have a large ground mount tank and have propane delivered. Some propane wall heaters do not need electricity.
Firewood stored indoors can be a bad idea if you have a large population of wood consuming insects. To paraphrase Don_P, "it is best to have any insects in the frozen wood wake up inside the stove".
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silverwaterlady
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 10:32am - Edited by: silverwaterlady
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I second the dry hardwood. It burns hotter and longer. A fat log of hardwood will burn all night.
The stove also needs to be big enough to hold enough wood to get you through the night.
I've never used wood to heat but all my relatives in Canada do because all they have is electric baseboard heat and it would cost about $600 per month to use.
I saw a pellet stove in action for the first time this fall at my local hardware store in Canada.
It was amazing because it was heating the entire store. The sales lady showed me the hopper that held 40 pound bags of pellets said they went through one bag per day during the fall (it was about 40 F that day).
The stove has a automatic feeder and blower but you of course need electric for that.
She told me everyone loves the stove because all one needs to do is dump the pellets into the hopper and your done.
Edited to include: I called one of my relatives in Canada today to find out how often they need to load their stove with wood for a 1000 sq ft one story house that is well insulated. Twice per day,once in the morning and once before they go to bed. The stove holds 40 pounds of dry hardwood.
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groingo
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 11:18am - Edited by: groingo
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What you may consider is a second heat source, propane for while you are gone and wood while you are there....split the load plus you have a backup in case you need it.
I don't recall how many square feet your place is. but knowing that there may be other options like zoning so you heat only the area you need to heat....even my place being inly 195 square feet has an insulated divider curtain to speed heating up....you just need to think outside the cabin!
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NorthRick
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 03:36pm
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A small direct vent, wall mounted propane heater. Fairly easy to install, doesn't tank up much room, and will keep things warm while you are away and in the morning. There are models that do not need electricity to work.
Burn wood when you can and propane when you can't.
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FishHog
Member
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 05:54pm
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Quoting: NorthRick A small direct vent, wall mounted propane heater. Fairly easy to install, doesn't tank up much room, and will keep things warm while you are away and in the morning. There are models that do not need electricity to work.Burn wood when you can and propane when you can't.
that is my setup, but you do need to consider the propane supply. That can be an issue if your remote. I carried a 30lber in to the cottage a few weeks ago. Won't be many more years I'll be doing that. 20's will give me more time but even they get heavy. Unless you can get delivery which Julie might be able to, since she can drive in, but even that might not be simple or cheap.
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cabingal3
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 08:20pm - Edited by: cabingal3
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dear friend.
i hope u are ok.i am so grateful this winter so far has not been too bad.last winter was something else.so glad u dont have to go thru that.
everyones correct.silverwater lady said u have to have a big box in your wood stove.also brick lined to hold heat.
there is a certain amount of wood stoving a person has to do.
your firewood is your gold.
thats why this last summer when gar cut downed trees into rounds...i was splitting them.gathering them and making ricks and stacking the wood.8 cords done by july.
i know u didnt have time to do alot.u have done so amazing.thought things out so well.i am amazed at all u have done.
we get up in the nite-check the wood stove.put some wood in it if its down.
we getup in the morn.put some wood in the stove.we check it in the day time.load it up several times in the day.me and gar go out and collect the firewood and bring it in and stack it by the wood stove...every day.
groingo said to partition off a certain area u wish to stay in and keep warm there...good advice.one year long ago.we bought a house and there was no heat in the whole house.my pre schooler son n i stayed in the kitchen all winter with quilts up on the doors and the oven door on 500 and opened.so we could stay warm.we made bread,colored and painted and made it thru the winter just fine.
u got a buddy heater.so good.
one thing i would suggest.u have seen my stove in my kitchen.i go in there early torch up all the burners.leave and let things warm up and go back and do my cooking.its a camp chef.
u may want to get one for inside your cabin.it really warms things up quickly.only thing .we use the big propane tanks.i can carry them but i have a hard time hooking them up.
i wear long johns under my clothes.i wear long johns to bed.if i have to run out to the john in the nite.i am not so frozen.alot of times if its really cold i wear a stocking cap to bed.
right now ...its been so cold.i have started my winter stock pot of fresh homemade soup going most all of the time.coffee is always ready too.just to warm us up.
praying u are ok.
i wish we were closer.the 70-80 mile trek thru the mountains and icy roads in our old autos is a bit too daunting.
take care.we will see u when we can.
batten down the hatches.snows coming tonite.hugs.cabi.
this stove rocks on heating up the place and for cooking on
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deercula
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2016 10:08pm
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Quoting: NorthRick A small direct vent, wall mounted propane heater. Fairly easy to install, doesn't tank up much room, and will keep things warm while you are away and in the morning. There are models that do not need electricity to work.
https://www.williamscomfortprod.com/product/direct-vent-furnaces/
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NorthRick
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# Posted: 14 Dec 2016 01:03pm - Edited by: NorthRick
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Quoting: FishHog that is my setup, but you do need to consider the propane supply. That can be an issue if your remote. I carried a 30lber in to the cottage a few weeks ago. Won't be many more years I'll be doing that. 20's will give me more time but even they get heavy. Unless you can get delivery which Julie might be able to, since she can drive in, but even that might not be simple or cheap.
For what it's worth, I haul in 100# tanks with a snowmobile as our cabin is not on the road. Julie's is and with a wagon or a sled it shouldn't be too bad to drag a tank from the car to where it needs to go. I'd argue that it's less work than handling firewood.
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Steve_S
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# Posted: 14 Dec 2016 01:31pm
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Julie I quite understand your situation but I would strongly suggest you consider the ongoing expense of pellets, storage of the bags and power usage (ongoing). You would be getting locked into an expensive consumerized product with a pellet stove and then be subject to pricing at the whims of the pellet producers. Inkjet Printer's are nearly given away for next to nothing BUT you pay on the ink cartridges and that is where the real money goes. I'm also always hearing grumbles about pellet stoves and their maintenance at the lumber yards & building supply shops I frequent, seems a constant.
Keep the wood stove and seriously consider a small Propane Direct Vent Heater as your stand-by ongoing heat to keep above freezing. Yes LPG is subject to the whims of the producer's as well but generally never get's crazy and worst case scenario, LPG devices / appliances can be run off Biogas.
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1tentman
Member
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# Posted: 14 Dec 2016 02:30pm
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Julie I have to agree with Steve_S LP seems to be your best back up to your wood stove.The money your going to spend on a pellet stove and buying pellets will go a long way towards paying for your LP set up.Also they will be less labor involved you wont have to go buy pellets and haul them to your cabin, you dont have to fill the bin, and you dont have to worry about keeping them dry. You can spend that time on stocking up the wood pile.I dont know what the regulations are in your area about tank size on your property, but I would look at getting 500 gallon tank and setting it stationary. We can contract Lp during the summer months at a lower price for delivery at a later date in our area,and a tank this size will last you for the whole winter, if you keeping using your wood stove as much as possible. Then when you are not feeling well and dont want to or cant fire the stove the Lp heater takes over and your set. The only draw back is as you find it easier to turn up the thermostat instead of firing the wood stove it could get a little more pricey.I would seriously look into the price of a big tank and its cost you dont want to be packing small bottles in and out especially during the winter months and you will be able to hook your cook stove up as well. You want to keep the wood stove and use it as much as possible, there is nothing better than setting in front of a fire on a cold night with your favorite drink, stay warm and be safe in your new adventure and Merry Christmas!
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paartisan
Member
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# Posted: 14 Dec 2016 07:06pm
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I concur with Steve_S and 1tentman about pellet stoves. You will become a slave to pellets, not enough flexibility.
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old243
Member
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# Posted: 14 Dec 2016 09:11pm
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My daughter has a pellet stove. She has a full sized house. They have an oil furnace , are away at work during the day, turn the oil furnace away back to about 60 degrees during the day. In the evening she fires up her pellet stove, it has an automatic lighter. It does involve a fair bit of maintenance , has to have the ash vacuumed out regularly .She probably burns 45 bags over the heating season. Part time. bags weigh 20kg, 45 pound. So that may be an issue.
I have a wood stove a pacific energy. We lit it in the fall, can only recall relighting it , a couple of times since, if we were away. We probably burn 10 face cord of good dry hard wood, in a season I have a bush and am able to cut my own. Our local price for dry hardwood is around 100.00 a face cord, if you have to buy it.
Get yourself a top quality air tight stove , they are not cheap, but last a long time. You have to ask yourself if you are physically able to cut , the wood or if you will have to purchase it. Personally I enjoy cutting wood, but am finding it more of a chore as time goes on. Good luck with your project. old243
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groingo
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# Posted: 15 Dec 2016 02:34pm
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Refresh my memory, how many square feet is your place....will help narrow down options and keep the costs down too.
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Asher
Member
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# Posted: 15 Dec 2016 08:02pm
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When we first bought our place it had a 1972 14x70 trailer on it.. it was a rotted mess with holes around the windows and doors big enough to stick your finger through... we needed to make weekend use of the place for 1 winter, but the furnace was an original 1972 Coleman propane unit... since I like life more then the challenge of breathing CO we decided to go out and buy one if these...
http://www.ruralking.com/mr-heater-30-000-btu-natural-gas-blue-flame-heater-mhvfb30tb ng.html
The thought was this heater would be just enough to knock the edge off and keep the interior above freezing... We where wrong that thing was easily able to heat the entire trailer to 70+ temps (using a couple fans to move the air)... During a cold 2.5 days (below freezing) we would use about 3/4 of a 20lb tank..
I don't know your cabin or location, but really sit down and crunch numbers... the cost of pellets, transport, price of stove... Then run that cost against the propane option (better if you bought a large tank and had a truck deliver)...
I am also told that pellets don't store well and have a shelf life... Also what would happen in heart of winter if the delivery truck can't make the pellet delivery you need or the store runs out? I don't know how far you live from town if this would be an issue or not... The other good thing about propane is that it's predictable, if you contract a large tank it has a gauge built in so you know well in advance if you need to schedule a refill... and propane stores for years and doesn't go bad...
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paulz
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# Posted: 16 Dec 2016 09:33am
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Quoting: DaveBell You should be able to build a fire, let it burn down so you have coals, load it again, then damp it down on the stove and the flue so it burns all night. Post a bunch a pics and lets see what you have.
Hmm, I'm able to damp mine down at the stove so it burns all night but I don't have a choke in the flue. Would that be of any additional value (holding heat in the stove)?
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Julie2Oregon
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2016 01:26am
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Hi gang, thanks for all of the replies and sorry I was MIA. We got the first big snow --nearly a foot -- followed immediately by a couple inches of rain because the temp warmed up. It's been messy.
And THEN it got quite cold and, guess what? I couldn't keep a good fire going to save my life because I couldn't dry out my wood fast enough. We FROZE last night. The Buddy heater and elec. space heater just weren't up to the task. groingo my shabin is 240 sq ft with the loft.
Thank goodness I've made some awesome friends here already who came right over, brought me some dry wood, and split my wood into smaller pieces for easier drying and burning. That's helped a LOT.
Here's the thing, I'm just looking to survive this winter in the shabin because I'll be building my actual place with ELECTRICITY and ductless heat/cooling. (Mini split) I don't want to put a lot more $ into the shabin but I do have to get through this winter. I want some sort of burner as an accessory in the main cabin. I still think pellet would suit me best, with a battery backup.
I am considering a ventless LP heater, about 20,000 BTUs for the shabin, though. Easy to move to the main cabin as a backup, too.
Propane would be more cost-effective. The heater I'm considering works on 20 lb tanks and I get my tanks filled at the KOA campground for $1.50/gallon. (Have I mentioned how much I love the OR state law that prohibits you pumping your own gas, including propane?! Sheer magic!)
Anyhoo, that's where I'm at. Firewood ain't cheap, and I'm going through a LOT of it with these temps and all of the damp from the precip. I bought 2 cords and had a guy chop up all of the trees on my land that came down last summer, too. I'll still need more. Big bucks. More than pellets.
My friends have offered to bring over their fifth wheel for me to live in this winter if the going gets rough. It has a propane furnace.
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Julie2Oregon
Member
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2016 02:00am
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toyota_mdt_tech
I think a pellet stove will suit in the main cabin, too. Those things pump out the heat, and I'm only going to be building about a 540 sq ft place. A bag of pellets will last me 2 days, easy.
For now, I've been doing exactly what you wrote. Bringi g in a few days' worth of wood and drying it out in stages -- lining it up in rows around the stove, when it's dried awhile, stripping the bark, and then continued drying around and on the stove. Still wasn't burning well much of the time. And my poor hands are cut and chafed to ribbons.
My friends cut the wood down into small pieces for me. That's helped. Dries faster and more thoroughly. But this isn't great. I hate it.
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Steve_S
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2016 07:08am
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Julie, I think I would be considering the 5th Wheel as an option. Not because I want you to give up on the Shabin and Cabin but because it has the basic essentials that will see you safe and sound. 2 Face Cords of wood won't last long if temps keep hitting the lows. Here (and I am in logging country) one face cord of Mixed Hardwood (8' long, x 4' high, by 16") which is 2 years stacked is selling for $85 a cord while city folks are paying closer to $120 per cord.
I would not think that the wood you cut on the property this year would be suitable for use as firewood unless it was "Dead Standing" and not going punky. The smoke from your chimney will, tell you all you need to know.
The Ductless Mini-Split could be installed into the shabin in a way that would allow you to move it over to the proper cabin when built. That way your only buying one item that will be relocated to where it is intended to serve it's life (thinking frugality and not wasting hard cash).
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Julie2Oregon
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2016 08:00am
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Steve_S
Regarding the fifth wheel, the 2 things that concern me are leaks and snow load. Even older manufactured homes around here have a sturdy shelter built over them to prevent problems with both. I can't pay for that, nor would I want to because it's not mine and wouldn't be staying here. So, it's a last resort, although I'm grateful for their offer.
I don't have electricity at the shabin so I couldn't install the mini split.
Wow, wood is a lot less expensive where you are! It's, on average $160/cord here and generally that's not split.
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naturelover66
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2016 10:05am
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Hi julie... Cant you have someone install a vented propane heater at your place?
With smaller managable tanks ?
I think ventless is a very bad idea.
Merry Christmas to you by the way.
Lisa.
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2016 10:29am
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Quoting: Julie2Oregon on average $160/cord here and generally that's not split.
That sounds like a true cord of wood, one that measures 8 feet x 4 feet tall x 4 feet deep. Notice that a couple of others used the term face cord. A face cord is 8 feet x 4 feet tall, but only one stove length long (16", 18"?). IMO, the term face cord is pretty meaningless.
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Gary O
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2016 11:28am
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Quoting: MtnDon Notice that a couple of others used the term face cord
Yeah, saw the ‘face cord’
Buying split/cured wood is not cheap…..anywhere.
Bottom line; gotta be warm
Right next to the bottom line; gotta be something less than miserable
Git; the three or even two burner camp chef cook stove
Use; 20lb tanks
Git; yer place warm
Git; yer food cooked, clothes dried
Use; yer head…about propane
Safety
Off and outside when yer abed
Now, wrestling 20lb tanks;
Git a cheap plastic toboggan;
Toboggans ($20 tops) will haul yer wood, water, genny, propane tanks, groceries…snow or no snow.
Lay the tank on it, on its side
No need wrenching yer guts out trying to heft it
20lb tanks will scoot unbelievably easy most anywhere when pulled on their sides
We are pretty much frozen in where we are
But comfy
Still
It’ll be awhile ‘fore we can visit
Consider
the fifth wheel offer
A silver (heavy duty) tarp
A snow rake
Gonna be a long winter
but
You got this
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SE Ohio
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2016 11:48am
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Another thought- A small/portable kerosene heater might be all you need? Check price of kerosene in your area, and factor in you'll have to buy an approved container (they won't fill a gas container with kerosene). If you buy a used heater, check that there is wick left else you might spend more on a replacement than the heater cost (!) Used kerosene heaters are as cheap as $5-$10 in my neck of the woods (unless there is a power outage, good time to sell  )
To be on safe side, have CO detector. My (non-vented) kerosene heater and range never have set off my detector.
If you have a sensitive nose, light the heater outdoors and let heat up a minute before bringing it indoors. Most kero smell is at startup/shutdown.
Use only clear K-1 kerosene, dyed stuff for fancy lamps costs more and can clog wicks. 5 gallons (recommended container size if you can lift ~30 lbs) might last a few weeks of night-only heating?
Keep your eye on the kero fuel gauge on the heater so you don't run the wick dry/burn it out.
Overall, this might be your cheapest solution for your temp living quarters?
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Gary O
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2016 11:55am
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Quoting: SE Ohio A small/portable kerosene heater might be all you need
good'n there
good advice
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