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cabingal3
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# Posted: 8 Dec 2010 08:04pm
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the reason i want to live off the grid is of course is to have my own heat and water and powers for free.
but i can not wait to test my skills on baking in the woods,and baking things on the campfire and in my kitchen once i get one.i have a summer kitchen now...
then raising food out there will be a challenge.and drying it and canning and hunting.and canning that.
sewing clothes and knitting socks.and my hubby has to wear what i make and cook.hee hee.
and it will be nice to make something -a sweater or knitted long johns and no one cares.we wil be out in the boonies...wearing and eating and making the things we want.
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MikeOnBike
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 12:02am
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Do you use a dutch oven much?
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fooboo
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 03:45am
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Why wait? You can do all those things wherever you are, especially if you have a summer kitchen. That makes for easier canning and processing.
The clothing idea is a tough one though. 100 years ago, textiles and fabric were very expensive and finished clothing was also expensive. I could see making your own clothes back then, but now we have the Chinese. Clothing is so incredibly cheap right now - clothes are as cheap or cheaper than bulk fabric. It's hard to justify the time it takes to make your own.
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cabingal3
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 07:48am
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MikeonBike.i have a dutch oven i got at a yard sale for 2 bucks...no lid.not much dutch ovening going on with no lid.thats my thing is i am looking all over for a lid.
fooboo.you are right about alot of things in your statements.yesterday...me and daughter were at kmart.i am a crafter.i have a craft group and us gals always talk about how the dollar store sure makes it hard on us crafters.anyway at kmart.2 pairs of gloves,one fingerless and the other a regular pair...one buck.one dollar.here i have been making gloves for all to fit them with no pattern and here is these gloves.cute and cheap.son of a gun.and it takes a while to do this project.so thats a subject for today on my crafting group.there is always the fact that i can fall back on-no one can beat the idea of a handmade gift.or a handmade item...i get huge bags of yarn from the 2nd hand store for under ten bucks and i could make socks.but we will have to travel to porltand to get that good of a deal.i could also spent the winter holed up in the cabin and snow when we live up there crocheting and knitting slippers ,hats,gloves,mittens and socks to sell at all the local tourist spots.and get a bit of money.
i could make clothes for us for so cheap...i got a huge box of nice fabric from a yard sale for five bucks.wool.very nice stuff.i can make quilts from old worn out clothes and an old worn out blanket and make it look nice.and useable.
so its the idea and the process.
i want to make fur hats from squirrels.
on canning ..well.thats what i was talking to hattie about before-i dont think our summer kitchen stove could get a big water bath canner heated up enough to bring it all to a boil.and i could not use the campfire in the summer there cause of fires.eventually i will get a more powerful stove in the next place we build cause it will have an actual kitchen with a stove in it.
well yes.time.when we are retired and stuck up at the cabin-i think i will have some time to make things.i know we will be battling lots of snow daily and keeping the fire going and the paths and roads cleared off of snow.and getting out to get foods.i plan on stocking us up good but u still have to go out and get restocked at times.
clothes are so cheap.i got to kmart when they are changing seasons and u can get ladies pants and shirts for a dollar .i got sweat pants from the dollar store.nice ones.u can not beat this.how i battle the high cost of patterns is...lay out the pants u wish to make-on fabric and cut.turn the pants and lay out and put on more fabric.as u are cutting out the front and the back and sew up the seams and turn waist under and add elastic and there u have some pants .u can use your clothes u have for patterns.
MikeonBike.i sure do plan on using and incorporating some dutch oven recipes in to our ways at home and the cabin.thanks for these ideas.
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larryh
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 09:04am
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Cabingal
Have you ever considered a oil cooking stove? The amish still use them in the old order groups and parts and wicks for Perfection brand stoves are still available. They will easily do your canning in summer with the ease of gas but a much hotter burner than a small hotplate kind of propane stove. They can be found on ebay from time to time and may need some restoration depending on where it was stored. I have a photo of a Boss brand three burner I am using for most of my hurry up cooking and heating when I don't want to start the wood range.
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larryh
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 09:05am
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This is the three burner boss stove. they no longer make wicks for it but he design is almost the same as the long chimney Perfections which they do make wicks for and used one seems plentiful.
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Jerry
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 09:43am
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Cabingal,
I share some of your dreams, although at my age (64) I'm planning a scaled down version. A few years ago I bought a wood burning cook stove and I'm dying to use it. It's not the big old ornate model, rather it's a smaller size that probably was made in the 40's, but it's still very attractive and it was used very little in its life. I can't wait to fire it up in a building I've got on the drawing board for this summer. It'll be in a canning/cooking/sausage making room in a multi use building. Another dream of mine is to build an outdoor wood fired oven. I've researched them and have the plans all ready to go. This will be an oven where you slow roast a large cut of meat - like a pork shoulder - for a number of hours at low heat. Get a wood fire going in it in the morning, start the roast at noon, add vegetables during the afternoon, and have friends over for dinner.
Good luck achieving your dreams. They are what keep us going. One of my greatest motivators is just the thought of the peace I would sense by being independent of the normal bonds of living. I want to be as warm in the winter as I deserve to be because of the fire wood I put up in the summer. I have fond memories of a relative of mine who is not gone. He would sit in his toasty kitchen near his wood burning stove on a cold winters day, sipping coffee with the window open just a little to get some fresh air. Every once in a while you would feel a cold breeze, just for an instance before the warm of the room returned. I love that memory.
Jerry
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cabingal3
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 04:03pm
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jerry.can u post a picture of your wood stove?that sounds pretty cool.well,i am going to get some kind of squirrel hunting gun on my b.d.,it was suspose to be on xmas but plans change.i want to cook squirrel and tan things.i want to shoot a deer and birds. and cut the meat up and can the meat.i really like the idea of an outdoor oven.good luck on your cabin and the wood stove and getting it hooked up.
hubby has to teach me to shoot.although i am pretty good in the homemaking skills of sock making,slippers and sweaters and cooking,growing gardens and canning,making quilts. i am also pretty good in being a helper for building the cabins.i just learned how to use the power drill and i love it.i have been scared of power tools but now i am not.so i have alot of things to learn yet.i am going along trying to get more skills to do the things i want.
we too have to get good soil going so we can get our fruit trees,and herbs out at our cabin.we have to be there and be living there before this happens.
what are the normal bonds of living to u?? i feel things like i want to have my own water and wood for heat and my own clothes line-here in town where our park is...we are not allowed to have a simple clothes line even if we have a wooden fence and no one would even know.so silly.i want to sit on my porch in the evening and look out at nature...our land.i want to not be stuffed into town where when i am washing my dishes i see clean thru the next door neighbors house.i want to be one with nature. i see what u mean...it is about the memories and feelings of exactly what u are talking about ...your relative sitting in his toasty kitchen by his wood stove drinking coffee and the window opened a bit for fresh air.those memories are exactly what are in my being.my dad was a mega hunter,fisherman and camper.we camped all over.and i ran wild in the back woods of louisiana and dad got an old slave cabin and had it hauled to our land on the lake.we ran wild.we chased wild pigs and shot my brothers b.b. gun and fished.me and brother.we had a big cistern for gravity fed water to our kitchen.every since then i wanted my own cabin.and i still do.hope it happens before i croak.lol! but it does keep one going and i do have the experience of going out to our woods and being and doing with hubby out there.it is such a joy.thanks for sharing your dream s of what u wish to do and will do.
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cabingal3
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 04:05pm
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larryh
that is a cool stove. i dont know...would it be underground gas lines?
i will have to look more into this but that is sure a wonderful stove.i have seen those at the sports and camp stores but i think they were propane ones.thank u for telling me of this.
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Rob_O
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 04:55pm
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The stove Larry posted is a kerosene wick stove. You can see more like it HERE
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cabingal3
Member
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 05:47pm
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ok Rob_O...thanks alot.now that is useable.thats maybe what i have seen in ads at camp stores.i will look into this.
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larryh
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# Posted: 9 Dec 2010 11:40pm
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I also happen to have a hobby of kerosene stoves, the one pictured is what is called Long Chimney stove, it uses a wick mounted on a carrier which is adjusted from the knob on the burner. It is clean and instant heat, no soot on your pans, really once its going it is just about like gas. The stoves on the link are of course new, they are what are known as wickless or sleeve burners. they do use a "kindler" which is a narrow wick that lays sideways in the burner an the oil is controlled by a needle valve and depending on how open you turn it the burner burns either low in the burner or up under the pan. The disadvantages of these stoves is many. I have had lots of the old ones that used this principle. They are slow to light, you have to wait for the wick to become saturated, then it takes about 8 minutes to reach its high heat. After that adjustments to the flame are slow because it has to burn off or wait for more oil to change the flame height in the chimney. If you pan drips any water, which they nearly always do, this type of burner "flares up" and causes a fast orange flame to engulf your pans covering them with soot. That is mainly why the Amish all use the Long Chimney Perfection stoves, and won't touch a wickless burner of this type unless they are really desperate for something to cook with.
I have a Yahoo Group which is devoted to Kerosene stoves, refrigerators, heaters, water heaters and lamp discussion. If you join the group you would find the catalogs for many old oil range and cookstove companies and instructions for their use along with home heaters an refrigerators.
Should you wish to find one let me know and I will try and guide you towards what to look for. Often without too much effort they will still work well. Another thing is that they made portable ovens for one or two burners and they do a pretty fair job of baking things as well.
Here is a link to the group;
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/KeroseneHeaterandStoveCollector/
The advantage to these is you can put it anywhere you want, no lines to install its all self contained, you just need to get a five gallon can for kerosene and have it handy to refill your little tank on the stove as needed. Its not exactly cheap to operate any longer, but the ability to have fast quick heat for your morning coffee or hot water is a plus even if it cost a bit to use. I also like to bake in my portable ovens when its hot and I don't want a fire in the range. They also made a stove top toaster as well as broiler for these. The toaster shows up once in a while, the broiler I have only seen one complete one and I own it.
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cabingal3
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# Posted: 10 Dec 2010 07:14am
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Dear larryh-we have kerosene stoves we use for heaters but not at our cabin.We are so careful to not have any spillage of kerosene or anything.We are at the point of super super paranoid careful cause of the easy fire danger there. i got scared just reading about the disadvantages of this kind of long chimney stove...the cool part is i did not know there was stoves of this sort.So now i have learned something new.
your group sounds pretty cool.
ok.i will join.thanks for telling me about this info everyone.gives me lots of thought for things i do not know.
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larryh
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# Posted: 10 Dec 2010 08:09am
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Cabingal, The long chimney stoves are not the ones that cause issues with flare up and hard to change settings, its the new small chinese made ones that were linked to in the post pervious to my reply.
Kerosene is not a very dangerous fuel. You can spill it on any hard surface and drop a match in it and it won't burn. What makes it burn is a "wicking" process so you do not want to ever have an oil heater being filled near a carpet since it would act as a wick. I bit of oil leaking from a burner or even oil on a burner to an oil stove won't normally be an issue. And that is not something that normally happens and is usually fixable as the connections on a perfection type stove have a nut to adjust the pressure on a fitting so it won't leak.
I think you would find that a kerosene cooking stove of the type I showed puts out less odor than a heater when in use and as in all oil appliances, keeping the wick simply wiped off every day or so in normal use will keep it burning cleanly.
Thousands of Amish cook on them and can on them daily. They still have the original Perfection equipment for making the basic burner parts and are producing brand new one, two, three and five burner stoves with ovens. However they are very expensive and you can find a nice simple older on which may need a bit of painting an a new set of wicks, but otherwise work as well or better than a new one. They just sold a refurbished Perfection two burner on ebay for 200.00 which is about 400 less than a new one. A used unrestored on often shows up at local auctions and sell in the range from a dollar or two upwards of 30 or so dollars unless someone is there who is reselling them to the amish.
I will watch for your membership request, I think if nothing else you will enjoy seeing the literature and range of stoves that various companies made. On that group you can also ask questions of operation and repairs and I will be glad to assist you.
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cabingal3
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# Posted: 10 Dec 2010 08:36am
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Thank u larryh for the correction in my misunderstanding.that 200-400$ is not too bad actually.i am going to look for them .This is good to know about kerosene also.thank u so much for all the info.i really know alot more now about some other options i never knew there was.\
cool! thank u.
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cabingal3
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# Posted: 10 Dec 2010 08:42am
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this is what i use out there right now.and the campfire when we can have it.it is pretty alright...but i dont think i could ever can with it.i know i cannt.it takes plenty of time to just get the coffee pot going.
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larryh
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# Posted: 10 Dec 2010 01:26pm
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Yes its a cute an I would guess expensive stove. I know from my use of coleman later stoves that it takes a lot longer to boil water on it than my oil models.
If you decide to check out oil stoves, be sure to get a late model Perfection as it has the most available new parts should you need any. Also they are easier to use. I don't see an option on here to write off the board but if you know of how to do it send me a note and I will be able to send you photos or information without writing it all on the board. I would be happy to advise you should you see something of interest and need help determining the condition.
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Rob_O
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# Posted: 10 Dec 2010 06:20pm
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Thanks for your knowledge Larry.
What do you think about the "sockwick" stove available on that site?
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dk1393
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# Posted: 10 Dec 2010 08:49pm
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To jump in on cooking. We use dutch ovens quite a bit. I love them.
Also for canning we use the propane burner and stand from the turkey deep fryer. It is a lot quicker than any stove. I use the metal wash tub and place some boards on the bottom and I can can 24 jars at once. Jackie Clay has a new book out on canning that I find pretty useful
http://www.backwoodshome.com/store/files/jc01.html
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larryh
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# Posted: 10 Dec 2010 09:52pm
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Rob, The little stove may be fairly well built and would be somewhat easier to adjust than the needle valve type I would give it that. The principle started out in the twenties with the "Lorraine" burner which was said to cook making its own gas and be quick to adjust. They became the rage though the late 20's and up to the 40s'. The last american company I know of to produce this type burner was Boss whom I have a full sized late range with glass window oven that originally came out after world war II. But by that time things were going down hill fast for oil ranges. Amazingly they hung on till the 70's producing a stove with that type of burner. Perfection as well as almost every other major range company had both the long chimney as well as the wickless burner stoves for some time. But the disadvantages of the burner outweighed the "focused" heat claim of it making "city gas in the country" which was a big selling point. The problems mostly as I mentioned, slow reaction to change of flame, slow starting times and worst to me, the tendency of the flame even when it looks clean and blue to leave a orange film on the bottom of you pots that is quite hard to remove after a while. I redid a large Sears 1937 range a couple years ago that had those burners as I personally always found them interesting in the way they work, but after lots of major work, I ended up giving it to a local museum because I just didn't like the flame "flare ups" and the slow time to light to heating. I can have a pan of water boiling on the perfection type long chimney stoves before the wickless one was up to speed. These new models may do it a bit faster and they would do the job of cooking, but I am pretty sure the downside is the same. Perfection also made a small one burner its a model #810. They show up on ebay but they bring a rather hefty price sometimes going for well over 100.00. I have boss long chimney one burner that is quite nicely styled and has a better cabinet to it in my opinion. I use it often as and extra burner. I will put a picture of it here and add the restored Sears I did.
Sears 1937 wickless range restored.
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Boss one burner Long Chimney stove.
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cabingal3
Member
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# Posted: 12 Dec 2010 11:58pm
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dk1393
thanks for the link.i love jackie clay.
cool stoves larryh
i joined your group but got sidetracked need to get there and see what is going on with it.the grandson has pneumonia and i have been busy.so will get to it very soon.thanks for this .and all the info u have on stoves.
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larryh
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2010 12:55am
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I hadn't noticed your membership request come though? If you get on the group drop a message to me and we can discuss some of the types of stoves shown in the catalogs.
Larry
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cabingal3
Member
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2010 02:43pm
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i joined.hmm.it said join group and i did.thank u.it may come thru.i need to go check yahoo.
another thing about living off the grid...about washing machines.i will just put our wash in a garbage can and ride to town once a week and agitate it all then rinse.and hang out in the meadow.
in the winter.it may be washing once a week and hanging to dry inside.or out but it will be frozen i am sure.
can u freeze dry clothes?
i suppose i will hook up jenny to my sewing machine from time to time.
my mixer is not really super important as i can knead bread dough and make bread.
how many own food dryers?? well i would have to get window screens and saw horses and some cheese cloth and just put the fruit and veggies out on the screens and dry them in the summer sun.i have done this before.it works good.
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cabingal3
Member
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2010 02:52pm
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ok i rejoined again ...for larry
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larryh
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2010 05:49pm
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When I rode the train though Canada one time years ago it was winter there. It was interesting to see all the cloths hung out and frozen on the lines. They say it eventually dries and the ice falls off, but I tied it only once and it never dried for me?
I have a James washer I have used for over 35 years. However my mom had to move due to an airport expansion about 6 years ago and built next to me here in the country. She of course has and likes everything modern. Well now I am spoiled and have a tendency to go over there and throw the cloths in the washer and dryer. I need to get back to my James, I miss it in a lot of ways.
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cabingal3
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2010 05:57pm
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sounds cool.i remember the old ringer washing machines.i was watching national geographic and it was all these families in the out back of alaska.i love that one.we finally bought the tape.i do not know if it is on dvd but we have the vhs version.anyway.they show an ole gal out grabbing her laundry off the clothes line and it is so frozen solid.but i never knew if they were dried or not.
i think once up in our woods...we will just know what to do for these common situations.i know when we lived on land before and i had the kids home-i would roll up my sleves and wash all the clothes in an old tin tub and hang things out on all the bushes.
Hey larry-thats pretty cool your ma moved in by u in the country.pretty nice.
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hattie
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2010 07:25pm
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Quoting: larryh They say it eventually dries and the ice falls off, but I tied it only once and it never dried for me?
hehehe...it has never dried for me either (and believe me I have tried)...Hubby just rolled his eyes when I tried to hang laundry outside in the freezing weather. Now I just hang everything inside on the drop down rack hubby built. The heater for the room is right beside it and the laundry is dry in a day or two. No extra electricity required and I really believe your clothes last longer. (I do have a dryer, but mostly just use that for our motel laundry.) In the warmer months I always hang our laundry on the clothesline outside. It smells so great when you bring it in the house! I don't know why, but I also like the look of laundry blowing on the line outside.
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Rob_O
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2010 08:43pm
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larry, do you have a picture of one of those "long chimney" burners disassembled? I'd like to see how it compares to a typical kerosene space heater burner assembly.
Here are a couple of off-grid solutions for laundry, the wonderwash and the countertop spin drier
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cabingal3
Member
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2010 09:19pm
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Hattie.i love laundry that is dried from outside.i love laundry dried inside.mostly i love laundry not in the dryer anyway.in the winter months stuck inside our cabin-as u say that drop down rack sounds really grand.i like anything that does not use electricity ...almost.i like my computer but i could do with out it.i think clothes do last longer too.
but Rob_o seeing those washers and dryers were fun.
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larryh
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# Posted: 13 Dec 2010 11:13pm
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For winter drying I have an old farm house and I happened to read that in the old days they used to hang cloths in the Attic. So when I added the couple rooms upstairs, one is a bedroom and the other storage with hook-eye's to stretch the cloths line between the rafters. It works fine. If its not drying fast enough sometimes I used to use a small bail type kerosene perfection heater and that would speed the drying.
I also have one of those wood round racks with lift up dowel rod kind of arms, the whole thing collapses to a small circular shape but opens to about 5 feet across with 10 or so arms. I use it for small things and the sheets would end up in the attic. I use the small rack down near the heating stove in the house.
Here are a few photos I tired to take of the Boss Burner lit and also showing the parts under the chimney. They use a round wick in a carrier without any tails. The perfection patent is a bit different but the same idea. Both burn a blue flame on medium and low with a wider and taller flame with short yellow tips on high. You can burn your hand within second of lighting the stove if you place it over the burner. They used to demonstrate them by holding a match over the burner an it would light almost as soon as the burner was lit.
Boss Oil Stove burner with chimney removed.
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Boss Oil Stove showing burning.
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