|
| Author |
Message |
DLMcBeath
Member
|
# Posted: 25 Jan 2015 01:36pm - Edited by: DLMcBeath
Reply
Ok, you guys scared me about using my ventless heater. As I said in an earlier post, I have an old Boxwood wood stove that used to be in my cabin but I removed it when I put a new roof on. I've been pricing chimney pipe, my goodness it's expensive 😮  can i use galvanized pipe on the outside of the cabin and black stove pipe inside? Looking for suggestions to cut cost. Right now, I'm looking at $1200 - $1600 for a double wall class "A" stainless chimney. I can't afford that. I know stainless will last longer, but I need cheap, and I'm not overly worried about meeting code.
|
|
rmak
Member
|
# Posted: 25 Jan 2015 01:57pm - Edited by: rmak
Reply
I don't want to scare you further (to make you feel good, I'm pricing a direct vent propane to supplement my woodstove because folks here scared me away from my kerosene heater) but, I believe at the consistent temp of a woodstove galvanized gives off toxic fumes. I can't vouch for this 100% but I'm pretty sure I read it somewhere. Hope someone else pops in to confirm or deny.
Have you tried to search craiglist for chimney components? I see double wall, etc. posted there from time to time.
I just checked on ebay. Three pages of double wall chimney components.
|
|
Just
Member
|
# Posted: 25 Jan 2015 02:06pm
Reply
No you can't use galvanized ...It releases poisonous fumes if it gets to hot . [gas or oil stove only ] Use black pipe or stainless only for a wood stove ..
|
|
Don_P
Member
|
# Posted: 25 Jan 2015 02:06pm
Reply
Galvy does give off toxic fumes when it gets hot, a yellowish smoke with a sweet taste. It should not be used for a stovepipe, especially indoors. Milk will reduce the effects if you ever happen to get into it.
A black pipe indoors up to a class A ceiling box and then continue that up to the rain cap. Getting a single wall pipe safely through the framing needs careful consideration if you go that route.
|
|
rmak
Member
|
# Posted: 25 Jan 2015 02:48pm - Edited by: rmak
Reply
I personally wouldn't do it. Not to be argumentative, but if you are worried about the potential risks of ventless, why wouldn't you be worried about the actual risk of toxic fumes?
Everybody here stresses safety above all, and I guess I've jumped on that bandwagon.
I mentioned craigslist. I just popped on to give you an idea. I know you don't live by me, but this is what you can find if you look around:
http://cleveland.craigslist.org/for/4858695180.html
People tear woodstoves out of their homes all the time. Stoves were popular some years ago , but because of the work and mess, lots are choosing other options. (administrators, I have no vested interest in that craiglist ad, and don't even know the seller, just trying to provide some info)
|
|
MtnDon
Member
|
# Posted: 25 Jan 2015 03:03pm
Reply
rmak's safety comment is right on the money; wood stove safety takes priority. Yes, stainless steel class A chimney pipe seems expensive. But it is a lot less expensive than a cabin fire with the possibility of loss of life. If galvy through the roof was a safe and viable option there would be no reason for class A pipe to be available.
|
|
DLMcBeath
Member
|
# Posted: 25 Jan 2015 03:11pm
Reply
I was going to use black inside the cabin and the galvanized outside.
|
|
DLMcBeath
Member
|
# Posted: 25 Jan 2015 03:13pm
Reply
I guess I assumed if I used the galvanized pipe outside there wouldn't be any fumes in the cabin.
|
|
|
ShabinNo5
Member
|
# Posted: 25 Jan 2015 04:07pm
Reply
DMLcBeath, we also were hit with sticker shock on the Class "A" pipe. In the end we kept monitoring Craigslist and found five 30" sections of used Class "A" pipe that fit our 8" ID requirement. Total cost was $300.
|
|
turkeyhunter
Member
|
# Posted: 25 Jan 2015 04:26pm - Edited by: turkeyhunter
Reply
Quoting: DLMcBeath I guess I assumed if I used the galvanized pipe outside there wouldn't be any fumes in the cabin.
I had thin wall galvanized pipe at my old hunting camp. Lasted a long time( 15 years) it was outside...blue /black pipe inside....stainless elbow outside a buddy made me...no problems
|
|
toyota_mdt_tech
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 11:37am
Reply
I had my stove pipe installed professionally. They used black single wall inside up to a support box in the ceiling. After that point, it was all stainless insulated stuff clean up to the cap. They added huge supports up high to also anchor the stove pipe for winds and sliding snow. The pipe from the support box up was pricey. I think it was about $200 a section which I think is 4 feet. The location of the pipe in the roof will determine how far it needs to go up. It must be (measured from the top, level plane), either 10 feet from the roof or 2 feet above the highest point on the roof. I think that is consistent. But could vary in your area.
|
|
Moomps
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 01:24pm
Reply
I recently purchased a used Vogelzang from a friend for a case of beer, but I figure that the black piping up to my cathedral ceiling and the stainless above that, along with all the accessories, will run me about $700+. Even with a new price for the stove, the venting is the most expensive part, and not a place to skimp. The last thing I'd want is a fire because I saved a couple bucks.
|
|
DLMcBeath
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 02:12pm
Reply
Do they make double wall galvanized chimney pipe?
|
|
MtnDon
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 02:18pm - Edited by: MtnDon
Reply
Never seen any, and that is probably because the mfg know the zinc coating can be hazardous to health when heated highly. Double and single wall pipe is indoor rated. Triple wall and the double wall insulated type (ClassA) are the only factory made types that can pass NFPA fire codes.
My advise is if the proper pipe is too expensive then don't burn wood. People who jury rig chimneys are placing not only their lives, but the lives of their loved ones at risk. Sure there are many risks in the world. However, from my point of view there are enough house fires from people who don't maintain a proper chimney, why mess around with something that has safety issues from the beginning. But again, you are in charge, you can do what you want (unless there is a building / fire inspection.) If you are trying to get some folks to agree with your interpretation of safety rules, keep looking.
|
|
bc thunder
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 02:29pm
Reply
I'm sure there's a good reason not to, but why not black pipe inside to the roof, then double stainless throughout the roof, then back too black pipe again.
|
|
bc thunder
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 02:47pm
Reply
If rust is the only issue, could you not use some "high heat" paint. For an engine block for example. You might not get into better homes and gardens, but for a cabin on the cheap.
|
|
DLMcBeath
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 03:35pm
Reply
Quoting: MtnDon My advise is if the proper pipe is too expensive then don't burn wood. People who jury rig chimneys are placing not only their lives, but the lives of their loved ones at risk. Sure there are many risks in the world. However, from my point of view there are enough house fires from people who don't maintain a proper chimney, why mess around with something that has safety issues from the beginning. But again, you are in charge, you can do what you want (unless there is a building / fire inspection.) If you are trying to get some folks to agree with your interpretation of safety rules, keep looking.
I'm not looking for a way to cut corners when safety is involved. I know nothing about wood stoves and wood stove chimney pipe. I just felt that SS class A chimney pipe is very expensive and wanted to know if there were any other options. Right now I have a new venless heater and blower, I'm just really questioning installing it. I have an old wood stove, but no chimney. I really enjoy this forum and I was just looking for advice. I have always said "if you're gonna do something.....do it right" thanks for all the advice, even if it's not what I want to hear.
|
|
TheWildMan
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 03:42pm
Reply
i used black stovepipe as a chimney through my first winter in my current location, i used a boxwood ($75 at a harbor freight, was on travel for work and picked it up, hauled it home 200 miles in the work vehicle), i set up a through the wall setup by using a single 2 foot section of insulated chimney (8 inch) as a heat shield through the wall, i used metal roofing and cinderblock as heat shields inside and ran the pipe up from the stove to a T joint, then out through the wall to another T, packing stones to fill the gap between pipe and chimney. the horizontal pipe was 4 feet long and the draft was poor. after that second T joint i used pipe to extend it up 8 feet above the height of the roof (to maximize draft) and used a simple rain cover cap.
this was not a good setup, it lost heat through the gaps (reducing insulation value for the cabin), the poor draft made everything smokey, there was a huge fize hazard as well so i used 2 CO2 detectors and 1 smoke alarm. it worked and cost less than $300 to set up everything, however i was living in the cabin (which didn't have enough room to stand up in without hitting my head on the roof, it was only 9x13 feet inside) and i had little money and the snow was falling.
you asked for suggestions so i gave them, but i don't reccomend this unless your desperate and have no other options, its better to install a proper chimney for safety and efficency.
|
|
DLMcBeath
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 04:05pm
Reply
Thanks for the advice. I just don't have $1200 right now. I'm gonna keep an eye on Craigslist. I'm also thinking about a Williams vented propane heater, this is a vented heater, but not a direct vent heater. I don't know.....I'm so confused!!!!!!
|
|
Nirky
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 05:33pm
Reply
Single wall (black) stove pipe for 6 feet or so from wood stove until the ceiling, then the box, then multiple wall pipe through the roof, terminating a minimum of two feet above roof ridge line. I'd go down to your local building supply and price out the materials and then do it yourself. I did, it's not that hard. It should be considerably less than $1200.
|
|
rmak
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 06:31pm
Reply
Quoting: DLMcBeath I don't know.....I'm so confused!!!!!!
That sound like one of my posts when I was trying to install solar. Just think you way through it and it will work out good in the long run. No one here is trying to steer you wrong.
Where are you? Where is this cabin you are building?
|
|
DLMcBeath
Member
|
# Posted: 26 Jan 2015 06:43pm
Reply
Thanks rmak, I know no one here is trying to steer me wrong. I think there a lot of great people on this forum, that's why I post on here for help.
my cabin is in West Virginia.
|
|
Tarmetto
Member
|
# Posted: 27 Jan 2015 10:14am
Reply
One thing that I've found with my setup (at home) is that creosote doesn't seem to cling to stainless pipe very well.
I have 15' of double wall pipe (stainless inner) from the top cap to a ceiling stub at the basement ceiling (professionally installed). I ran stainless single wall from the stove to the stub. This was 15 years ago, and I burn anything that creates heat. So far I haven't had the need to clean the pipe at all. True, I have a straight run, no elbows, which helps.
I also run the crimped end of the pipe towards the stove....that way any creosote runs back into the stove rather than outside the pipe at the joints. Some will swear that running the pipe this way will put smoke in the house....hahahaha...not if you have a draft.
I also installed an in-line damper in the pipe, about 4' above the stove. Even though my stove seals up fairly tight, this was a big help in controlling the burn.
|
|
Steve_S
Member
|
# Posted: 27 Jan 2015 10:33am
Reply
Just a point to ponder... on insurance & insuring...
I have spoken with my own insurance people (brokerage) about reusing wood stove chimney pipes etc in my build... a few companies will only accept "New & Pro Installed" chimney's. But per my broker, reusing pipe is not a problem "if" the stampings & certifications are still on the pipes and clearly visible. Apparently many companies will accept that, just have to find the right ones.
I'm recycling previously enjoyed chimney pipe which is stamped & rated but as I am off-grid and independent, I have a lot less hoops to jump through. Certain things still need inspection & verification for insurance purposes and surprisingly I found that many companies won't even touch off-grid cabins, so having a good broker has helped out a lot.
|
|
LastOutlaw
Member
|
# Posted: 2 Feb 2015 03:44pm
Reply
If galvanized pipe was used, once the pipe had been cooked heavily for awhile wouldn't it be safe to use once all the zinc burned off?
I was researching and found this:
http://donkey32.proboards.com/thread/373/afraid-galvanized-pipe-anyways
|
|
soundandfurycabin
Member
|
# Posted: 3 Feb 2015 01:56pm
Reply
You can minimize the length of class A pipe needed by having the chimney exit as close to the ridge as possible.
|
|
|
