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grover
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2016 02:44pm
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I am going to have around 3000 sq ft of pine if I use all wood on my interior walls and ceiling. I can't imagine staining and polyurethaning all that before it goes up but I think that's what most advise. I've seen pics where it looks like no stain or poly was used at all. It may work but I would think the bare wood would get dirty, especially around doors and places that see a lot of hands.
What about putting it up bare (no stain or poly) and then spraying poly on afterward?
Need experienced advice.
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2016 03:28pm
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I've used a fair amount of poly on furniture, and done a fair amount of spraying. Problem is that you really need to sand between coats or it comes out looking pretty poor. Sanding once it is up is a pain in the rear.
Another thing is that planer marks show up more so with a finish on the boards, however you do it, so it's worth taking them to a wide belt sander to knock off the marks.
I would never use gloss poly on anything, only the satin. And I have noticed a big difference between the bargain brand polys and the more expensive stuff.
It's a pain, but painting always goes better done flat on saw horses
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sparky30_06
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2016 04:15pm
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bldginsp
you just brought back nightmares of spraying lacquer in a custom cabinet shop back when I was in High School. High gloss and sanding between 3 to 4 coats. oh the joys
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2016 09:48pm
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Sparky- getting high off of lacquer thinner is just such a joy- until you realize it's probably killing you. Yuck! Bizarre stuff. I have friends so sensitized to the stuff one whiff makes them dizzy. Better living through chemicals!
Grover- using wipe-on oil like Watco is enough to prevent staining of the wood, requires no sanding, is relatively easy to apply and looks good. Film finishes like lacquer, poly, oil based varnishes or water based are much more time consuming and not necessary for interior finish on walls, doors, trim etc. Furniture and cabinets, another story, they need more protection.
One woodworker I knew made his own wipe on finish with 2/3 Watco, 1/6 poly, and 1/6 some kind of wax or maybe paraffin. Never tried it myself.
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2016 09:54pm
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Bob Flexner is the best expert on wood finishes I've encountered, here's a good article from him on wipe-on poly;
http://www.popularwoodworking.com/techniques/finishing/the_basics_of_wiping_varnish2
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Cowracer
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2016 10:05pm - Edited by: Cowracer
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I've used shellac. Not quite as good as stain and poly for protection, but still offers a decent level of protection to the wood.
I rolled it on, and then drug it out with a dry brush right away. You gotta work fast, its dry (as in 'Dry' dry) in about 15 minutes. Its generally pretty forgiving, as long as you are well ventilated, as the solvent is alcohol, and you can get quite a buzz going if you arent careful.
I did 2 coats and I think the look is beautiful.
Tim
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gsreimers
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2016 11:42pm
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I have an advantage as I am a painting contractor for a living. I also am in the process of finishing off my 24' x 32' cabin and 3 12' x 12' out bunkhouses and shower houses with 12' tongue and groove pine.
I am prefinishing with lacquer. Yes it is nasty smelling but with a respirator and in my garage with a fan for ventilation, it is no big deal.
Why lacquer? 1. very durable, scratch, moisture and everything else resistant. 2. quick drying. I buy the boards 100 at a time. Lightly presand them to get rid of dirt and other crud. Spray, stack, lightly sand, vacumn and recoat. I can do 100 boards from start to finish in a day. By the time I get done spraying the 100th board, the first is ready to sand.
Prefinish, yes, if they shrink, the gaps are finished. Also, as I have to haul them 220 miles north and then across the lake in a boat, finished boards will not get dirty and are ready to install when I get them there. I put them finished side to finished side with a strip of toilet paper in between.
best of luck with your project
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Steve_S
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# Posted: 5 Nov 2016 07:36am
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There is a lot of products out there and some require more effort that others, some are crazy expensive too and if you have a boo-boo - well let's not go there....
Shellac can be tinted or left as Amber (clear is available but more $) and stands the test of time plus once dry it's tough + it is non-allergenic and no off-gasing afterwards. Believe it or not, I still have a few items I made in early wood working classes a few decades ago that got shellac'ed and they still look great....
Dries Fast but can be diluted/reduced with denatured alcohol, can be light sanded and recoated quickly too adding depth.
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 5 Nov 2016 08:47am - Edited by: bldginsp
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The only problem with shellac is that it is not moisture resistant. If it gets wet the water makes marks. In most interior situations that wont matter, but if you live where there is enough humidity to condense water on the walls occasionally, it will mess up the shellac. Easy to fix with a wash of alcohol, but a lot of work.
The amber color of shellac is hard to beat.
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KinAlberta
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# Posted: 5 Nov 2016 07:11pm
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Like linoleum isn't shellac a mostly natural product too?
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 5 Nov 2016 08:14pm
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Shellac is entirely a natural product. It is literally the excretion of the Lac bug which lives in India and Southeast Asia. The bugs make little cocoons with their excretions. The locals harvest the cocoons, melt them down, filter the goo, then harden it into flakes. No other processing. Blonde shellac is processed to remove the amber color. If you buy flake or button shellac, you dissolve it in alcohol and then strain it through cloth, and it's not unusual to find insect legs or wings in the filter. Shellac is edible, the put it on M+Ms so they melt in your mouth, not in your hand.
True linoleum is made with linseed oil, and what else I don't know. It is still available, more expensive than vinyl and the other petroleum based formulations, but is still regarded as one of the best of the 'resilient' floorings.
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Cowracer
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# Posted: 7 Nov 2016 11:27am
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Quoting: bldginsp The only problem with shellac is that it is not moisture resistant.
I find that if offers an amount of moisture protection. I have had a spill against the backsplash of my countertops that wiped up ok and did no lasting damage. Again, no where near what a good stain/poly job would provide, but better than bare wood.
It is moderately tough. Maybe not tough enough for floors, but it is showing good duty on my walls. I did manage to scuff it pretty bad at the bottom up my stairs, trying to wrangle in the bed headboard. The fix was simply recoating it with a dilute shellac mix. The alcohol dissolves the surrounding shellac and it flows together nicely to cover the damage.
Tim
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 7 Nov 2016 03:24pm
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I agree Tim. Water on shellac causes no problem if quickly wiped up. Leave it for a while and it leaves a white spot. It's probably fine in most interior applications where temp is controlled year round. But in cabins that are empty and unheated for months, condensation can occur on the walls.
Shellac used to be a common floor finish, but no more because the plastics are far better wearing.
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Cowracer
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# Posted: 8 Nov 2016 09:52am
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Quoting: bldginsp Water on shellac causes no problem if quickly wiped up
Sad part was.... It wasn't water. It was rum! Capt. Morgan's Private Stock, in fact 
Lost about half a fifth in total. The cabin still reeks of booze (not necessarily a bad thing). I was so pissed, I couldn't even cuss coherently for about 20 minutes.
Tim
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