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Jeremy
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2014 10:40pm
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I'm planning on wiring the cabin within the next few weeks so I can start insulating and finishing the inside and through all the research I have done I haven't found the answer to my question. So I turn to you guys!
Does your main electrical panel need to be located on an exterior wall?
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2014 11:05pm - Edited by: MtnDon
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Not necessarily.... Although in a small cabin mounting it on the outside of an exterior wall is sometimes the most practical. By NEC a service panel can not be placed in a clothes closet or bathroom.
In addition... NEC 110.26
Sufficient working space shall be provided around electrical equipment. The depth of that space in the direction of access to live parts shall be a minimum of 3 feet and the minimum width of that space shall be the width of the equipment or 30 inches whichever is greater. This workspace extends from the floor to 6.5' and shall not be used for storage.
And....
The NEC specifies that the location of the breaker box "must be as close as practical" to the service entrance. This allows some leeway in the location of the breaker box, but also restricts it. You should not locate a box on the opposite side of the home from the meter. In general, this restriction in the NEC encourages you to determine the circuit breaker box location and from that determine the service entrance equipment location. The service entrance equipment includes the meter, meter base, outside disconnect and the mast extending up through the roof. For example, don't run the service wiring 30 feet inside the house before you connect it to the main circuit breaker box.
The AHJ (authority having jurisdiction) trumps whatever is written in the NEC.
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Jeremy
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2014 11:14pm
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The cabin is 16x20 with a 16x10 loft. the bathroom and kitchen are located on the side the service will enter and the only practical place to put the panel would be in a closet beneath the stairs. with such a small floor plan its hard to hide it from the wall space. I also plan on adding a bedroom on to the cabin within the next 5 years so it cant go on the wall leading to that room.
would you think the loft is a practical code compliant location or the closet a better spot?
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Jeremy
Member
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2014 11:15pm
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or is there an exterior breaker box one can install?
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MtnDon
Member
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2014 11:23pm - Edited by: MtnDon
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There may not be as many outdoor panels made but they are available. About a third of the houses on my street have exterior panels.
Link
They need to be readily accessible; under stairs or in a loft does not really meet that criteria.
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 24 Nov 2014 11:32pm
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Place the outdoor panel where it is most convenient. The wires can run out the top through conduit and then through the wall into attic space, if any, and down inside walls as needed. Or down and under the floor and up inside the walls. Or run the wires out the back of the panel into the wall cavity.
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22hemi13
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# Posted: 25 Nov 2014 06:16am
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Thats mine in the living room area. It's big cause I left it rough behind it in case I want to add another circuit. My wife will mount a few things on it in the future I'm sure. And it is right where my service comes in
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PatrickH
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# Posted: 25 Nov 2014 07:15am
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There is a maximum length of wire that can be run unprotected from the meter socket to the panel. For me I think it was 6 feet,but you should check your local masters.You will need to add an outdoor disconnect if you get too far away,also service entrance cable can get expensive quickly .
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Steve_S
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# Posted: 25 Nov 2014 08:18am
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If your attached to the "Grid" check local building regs, State / Province requirements. Usually if grid attached you need a permit & inspections as well and insurance won't cover if you don't.
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old243
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# Posted: 25 Nov 2014 08:52am
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If you haven't a suitable location inside the cabin. Adjacent to the meter location . Not sure if you are feeding your cabin , overhead or underground. You can locate your meter, at the location , approved by your supply authority, then go back underground around the building to a suitable location, for the panel and disconnect, and enter the building.
Our utility specified that meter be located on the front or within 1 meter of the front of a building. You could then go back underground to another location for your service. This was so meter would be accessible, for meter reading. Not away round back somewhere, complete with a locked yard gate and a cross dog. I have seen it all. This probably would not apply at your cabin, but is the reason for some rules being in place. Also as stated a closet is a poor location for a panel. A good first step is to run it by your local hydro, get their opinion , Good luck with your project. old 243
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Jeremy
Member
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# Posted: 27 Nov 2014 10:38am
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Thanks for your help! I will have to contact the electric company before I start. I called them last year to get a price to run it out to the cabin. Its about 300 feet from the road and the line of course is on the other side. So, they have to boar under the road and will be running it underground.
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 27 Nov 2014 09:38pm - Edited by: bldginsp
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To your original question, you can put the service equipment anywhere the utility will allow. They want access to the meter so it has to be outside, but does not have to be on a wall. It can be on a post in the yard, in which case you would have a single breaker feeding feeder conductors that lead into the building to a sub panel, which as Don said can't be in a bathroom or a clothes closet.
And, as stated, the main disconnect needs to be as close to the meter as possible. The conductors before your first disconnect have no overcurrent protection, you can't shut them off. They can't go thru the building. But feeders, after a breaker/disconnect, can go thru the building.
Don't put the meter on a bedroom wall, because the meter makes noise and will bug you at night.
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old243
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# Posted: 29 Nov 2014 09:32am
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Jeramy, You mentioned the utility would have to bore the road , as the main line was on the far side of the road. I would hope that they would come to your lot line at their expense. They may have to increase they height of the pole on the opposite side of the road as well , to acommodate a transformer. They could install a clearance pole on your side of the road and then go underground. It all depends on the utility policy .You don't want to end up replacing, some of their pole line that could be aged and need replacement , in any case. Be sure and be present when the utility layout rep comes, so you know what is involved, and the costs to you. My brother in law put power in their new cottage, when the rep saw the age of the road pole, he replaced it at no cost. Every pole has the date stamped in them, as well as the class and type of pole .If it is quite old you could suggest that it ,probably needs replacing anyway. This is probably way more info than you need , but is good to know when you are dealing with a utility. Good Luck old243
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Jeremy
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2014 10:14am
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Everything this utility company does is underground now... They did ask if I wanted a pole but it would have been the same cost anyways. I did research and see outdoor panels are about 30 bucks more, but then I wont have to look at it in the cabin so it was worth it to me. Everyone I talked to has an opinion about them from people messing with them to when adding on access to it. But for the time being and what we are using the cabin for I think it will work just fine. I will contact the electric co op today, but does the owner purchase the meter box typically?
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PatrickH
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2014 11:24am
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Aren't you in Wisconsin? If so you may or may not have an issue doing the elec yourself.They passed some new laws last year preventing it.My brother just put elec. in Burnett county they let him sign as the homeowner where the master electrician normally would and they hooked him up,but different areas may say no and yes everything needs to be installed before they will hook it up,and they check before you get on the list and after Nov. I think there is a ground thawing fee.Check your poco's web site they should have all the info you will need and should have a diagram of how they want the meter,panel,ground rods etc. installed.And generally they give you an estimate of cost which you pay upfront and It may be more or less,we where refunded over 400 after the install, I am in douglas county and pulled my permit before the new laws took affect
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Jeremy
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2014 03:43pm
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Ah nice! There were no permits required for something 400 Sq. Ft. or smaller. I will check if I need a sign off from a master.
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old243
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2014 10:29pm
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jeramy, In Ontario the meter base and all service equipment is supplied by the home owner. Likely the same there, but check with the utility
I wired my daughters house several years ago. She took out the permit. I have held an electricians licence since late 60's. Now I have to work under a master electrician, so I gave up my licence this year. Lots of red tape and BS. old243
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