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Martian
Member
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# Posted: 12 Oct 2012 02:23pm
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A hole in the diaphram would only cause the pump to cycle more frequently; as if you didn't have the tank. It wouldn't effect the prime. The loss of water in the pickup line should not be happening......period. If it loses 1/2" in an hour with no pressure applied, just imagine how fast it would lose it under 25-30lbs of pressure. Since the line is so easy to replace, and is relatively cheap, replace it. There is no sense in continuing to troubleshoot once you have identified at least one problem. Fix it. Then, let's see if there is another problem.
Tom
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zoodlemaker
Member
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# Posted: 12 Oct 2012 03:03pm
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Still having the box the pressure tank came in, there was a help line phone #. Gave them a ring to ask if it sounded like there could be a bladder problem.
In the course of that conversation, one thing came out, that being that the pump may be trying to draw water from too far down. Our lake level goes down 5' over the course of the year, being at its lowest at about this time of year. So in the spring we're drawing our water up from close to 20' rise, over about 110' (1 1/4" hose). At this time of year, with the receded shore line and water height, we're drawing up more like a 25' rise (the limit for our 1/2 hp pump), over 125'.
I'm not 100% sure that this is our only problem at this point, but I think this project has to be scrubbed until next spring when the ice has melted, and the water is higher. Our pump is no further from the water than ever before, and the water has always gone down. Perhaps it's extra low this year.
When we first had the problem and started investigating, several of the connections we had made when installing the pump, pressure tank and foot valve were EXTREMELY loose for some reason. So we must have been drawing air for a month or so. Perhaps an air bubble got large enough, and got into a particular spot, and that's what caused the sudden drop? I don't know, and won't know for a few months.
Thank you so much for you time, attention and kind suggestions, you've been fantastic.
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zoodlemaker
Member
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# Posted: 12 Oct 2012 03:06pm
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Tom, we've messsaged at the same time. Now you've got me going again, I'm a bit like a dog with a bone  It should definitely be replaced. Thanks.
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Martian
Member
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# Posted: 12 Oct 2012 03:28pm
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Have you considered a submersible pump? It is a lot easier to push water than it is to suck water. All you'd need to do is run electrical down to the lake.
The lift may be part of the problem; a submersible would cure that.
Tom
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zoodlemaker
Member
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# Posted: 12 Oct 2012 05:05pm
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Yes, I did look into a submersible, and have even wished I had gotten one since installing this other one....the pump is under the cottage, and there are times it would be better to not have to listen to the motor.
However, I think they started at $2,000, and our jet pump was $200 or $300-something, and fit into the set-up we already had in place.
So we'll struggle on with this one. Thanks for setting aside my concerns there might be a problem with the pressure tank.
Sandra
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Martian
Member
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# Posted: 12 Oct 2012 06:07pm
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Sandra, you are way off on the cost of a submersible. This one should work for your needs http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200329799_200329799 Its less than $500.
Another possible solution would be to build a small "pump house" closer to the lake, thus reducing the lift and getting the noise out from the living space.
Tom
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zoodlemaker
Member
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# Posted: 13 Oct 2012 11:44am
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Tom, I seem to have lost the link to the system I was looking at. I think I saw it advertised in Cottage Life Magazine...should have known it would be on the pricey side. That would have been ideal.
I like your idea of a pump house. It's never occurred to us before. Some cottages have that arrangement on the lake.
Sandra
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Martian
Member
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# Posted: 13 Oct 2012 04:55pm
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I have one more question for you, Sandra. What's a "zoodle"?
Tom
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zoodlemaker
Member
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# Posted: 14 Oct 2012 07:36am
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You made me laugh out loud. No one's ever asked before .
When I was in grade 5 or 6 the teacher was trying to make the point that names for different numbers are arbitrary. As an example he asked what would you call 10 to the power of 27......I called out "A Zoodle".
A couple of years ago we had an elementary school reunion, and people still remembered me for it. I guess I could be remembered for lots worse.
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Martian
Member
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# Posted: 14 Oct 2012 08:33am
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To paraphrase Red Green, 'If women don't find you handsome or handy, at least leave 'em laughing.' SUCCESS! I'm really glad my curious mind had to know, and that the question triggered such a nice memory. 27 zeros would definitely be a zoodle.
Have a great day!
Tom
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zoodlemaker
Member
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# Posted: 14 Oct 2012 01:31pm
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A fellow Canadian, I'm guessing, with the RG reference. Course I no doubt gave away my Canadian roots by using Duct Tape on my pump connections
Have a good one.
Sandra
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Martian
Member
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# Posted: 14 Oct 2012 02:17pm
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Actually, I'm in Kansas...........humor is international. I thought you used duct tape out of ignorance. I had no idea it was a national obsession. Just so you know, I tried it a few times myself, but eventually I learned. You would have figured it out. Duct tape has a lot of uses; unfortunately, sealing water leaks isn't one of them.
Tom
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larry
Member
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# Posted: 14 Oct 2012 03:30pm - Edited by: larry
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Quoting: larry so i read your original post again...you say you're sucking water from thirty feet below the pump??? what is the max lift of the pump? you may be beyond the pump limit. check the max lift of the pump
ever have a crack in your drinking straw? if you have an air leak at that amount of lift you could have a great deal of air entering the system.
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Martian
Member
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# Posted: 14 Oct 2012 03:43pm
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As soon as she mentioned the extra lift during the summer, I thought of your earlier post. Good call.
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zoodlemaker
Member
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# Posted: 15 Oct 2012 06:39am
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We've had this same system set-up for years, and for years I've wondered why the pump seemed to run a lot longer in October. No more wondering. Good call, larry, thanks.
You're all so right, that loss of suction happened when a tap was opened, creating the hole-in-the-straw effect.
First order come spring thaw will be to replace the hose.
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