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jjlrrw
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# Posted: 14 Sep 2011 02:25pm
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Hello, I just found this site, signed up and here is my first post.
We just purchased 700sf cabin, 2 bedroom, living area, kitchen/dining area and small bath. It has electric, a well in an outside pit with excellent water and pressure, small LP gas cook stove and at this time no heat. We plan to use it year round but not heat it throughout the winter cabin in located in Michigan so it will be below freezing early November into April for the most part.
We are leaning towards a pellet stove for heat and an LP gas on demand tankless water heater.
I plan to plumb the cabin because it has been sitting for years and it was not 100% drained so we feel there could be many leaks we have not yet hooked water to the cabin because we could see the first broken pipe under the sink.
Coming out of the well pit there is a 1/2" OD soft copper pipe being routed out the side of the pit, underground and up through the cement slab the cabin is built on. There is also a second pipe routed out and up to an outside faucet.
The copper pipe enters the cabin in the rear corner where the kitchen sink is and the balance of the plumbing is all located across the rear wall of the cabin.
This 1/2" copper pipe looks to be in good condition and trying to replace it looks very difficult as the pit is butted up to the cabin slab. I was thinking placing a drain in the pit, adapting the copper to CPVC and slop the entire pipe to drain back into the pit. Also plan to replace the outside faucet with a frost free so it won't freeze.
Do you think this would work for draining when we leave for the weekend? Being the copper entering the cabin is 1/2" what size CPVC pipe should I use for my main run? As far as draining the water heater it has some good instructions on how to plumb it.
Also a well pit is new to me and will I have trouble with the pressure tank that is located in the pit, will it need to be drained?
Sorry for the long first post.
Thanks,
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 14 Sep 2011 03:11pm
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I don't know much about wells since I don't have one.
I will say though that if I was re-plumbing anything or plumbing anything new I would use PEX over everything else. It's easy to work with once you have the tool. The tubing is not harmed by freezing, though the fittings and valves can still fail if frozen with water in them.
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Just
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# Posted: 14 Sep 2011 04:48pm
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where is the pump in the pit or down the well ? how deep is the pit ,is there a good insulated lid ? is there a hydro line going to the pit ? is the pit proned to to flooding ,[marks on the walls ] ?? many pits flood need a sump pump to protect the pump moter if it is in the pit . you could put a hydro pump- house heater in the pit I would they don't cost much to run in a pit !!yes you can drain everything into the pit then u you wouldent have to worry about anything above the pit..Ontario here similar weather .
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jjlrrw
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# Posted: 14 Sep 2011 05:05pm
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Yes vertical jet pump in the pit, guessing the pit is 5' deep, I need to build a new lid so yes it will be insulated well, I don't think it will flood and no sign of flooding.
Not sure what a hydro line is but I would bet there is not one.
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Just
Member
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# Posted: 14 Sep 2011 10:49pm
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if there is a pump there is power so yes you can put your pressure tank in the pit . I would still put a heat tape in the pit [they only come on at 34 f. ] so if it indeed it stays above freezing down there you will use no power at all !! sounds like you have plans in place now just make sure every thing runs down hill to the pit and it should be only a mater of opening 1 velve in the pit and all taps in the cabin to drain the system. don"t forget the pluming antifreeze for the traps good luck !!
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jjlrrw
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# Posted: 15 Sep 2011 01:33pm
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Thanks,
Plan to start running the lines within the next two - three weeks.
Looked into PEX but still leaning toward CPVC, Cost, tools needed, availability and ease of connecting.
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PlicketyCat
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# Posted: 16 Sep 2011 06:12pm - Edited by: PlicketyCat
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You can find PEX nearly everywhere now, along with all the common connectors. The cost is the same or lower than CPVC, but it is seriously easier to work with since it is flexible and usually only requires connectors at junctions, not at every single bend. The connector crimping/banding tool isn't that much more expensive than a decent pipe cutter or hack saw. PEX can also be run through a main manifold, where you can cut off water to any line from one single point... including shutting off and draining all the fixtures and opening up a main drain line back to the pit right from the manifold . The main drain can be a larger diameter than the input lines for seriously fast draining of the entire system.
But the major advantages of PEX anywhere that there is a freeze-up hazard is that PEX expands so can take some freezing and, since it's flexible, you can do straight runs without any connections whatsoever inside the wall. Freeze ruptures in PEX normally occur only at connections, so you'd only have to worry about it right at the mains and the fixtures where it's easily accessible.
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jjlrrw
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# Posted: 19 Sep 2011 03:49pm
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I will need to look into the PEX again, after entering the cabin I have a straight run the length of the rear wall then a 90° another 5 ft run to a 90° to the bath sink. Along the was I will have a Tee, at the kitchen sink, water heater, toilet, shower and elbow to the bath sink. Then out of the water heater to a tee back to the kitchen sink, shower two 90°'s to the bath sink.
The pipe entering the cabin is flexible 1/2" OD copper pipe, should I bump the pipe size to 3/4" for the main run or just do 1/2" through out.
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Just
Member
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# Posted: 19 Sep 2011 07:38pm
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I would not but it might save a shower shock or two!! you use less hot water with 1\2 in . pipe .
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Borrego
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# Posted: 19 Sep 2011 10:03pm
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As a General Contractor; +1 on Pex!! Put it my own cabin. The only downside, it won't take direct sunlight well....
Big savings in time and money! And lasts forever.....
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PlicketyCat
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# Posted: 20 Sep 2011 07:30am
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jjlrrw Sounds like you could put in a small central manifold and branch straight runs to/from each fixture if you wanted. PEX comes in red and blue (and other colors) so it would be easy to keep your hot and cold supplies in order. Probably wouldn't need any of those elbows as long as you don't have a hard kink in the line either. There are several adapters to take different pipe types and sizes to PEX... even easier than with CPVC.
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jjlrrw
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# Posted: 20 Sep 2011 12:42pm
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Do you feel the Pex could bend a 90°, I am looking at going through the outside stud walls to get to each fixture.
Also would you use the clinch style or the copper ring style? Also any recommended tools? There is no one local that rents the tool.
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Montanan
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# Posted: 20 Sep 2011 03:06pm
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Just want to echo the others about PEX- made the plumbing really simple for us. I'm not sure about a 90° bend, but you could get pretty close without getting a kink.
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PlicketyCat
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# Posted: 21 Sep 2011 12:38am
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The cinch/clamp tool isn't that expensive (<$50 for DIY quality) and you can order them online if you can't find them locally. I used this one when I did some upgrades to my former house and it worked pretty well since I had multiple sizes of old pipe to connect to.
A true 90° would probably kink, but a gentle corner is totally do-able. I've done a nearly right angle bend through the studs in corners and through top/bottom plates from walls to floors/ceilings. It's pretty much the same rules as running RoMex electrical wiring.
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jjlrrw
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# Posted: 21 Sep 2011 11:24am
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Thanks,
I do see the cinch type and the copper ring type of connections.
It would not be a true 90° but like you said through corner studs and if I drill my holes with consideration I could reduce the bend even more.
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jjlrrw
Member
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# Posted: 21 Sep 2011 11:43am
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Also wanted to ask, do you use the poly or copper connectors? "Tee's etc"
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PlicketyCat
Member
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# Posted: 22 Sep 2011 06:52am
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I got copper connectors to connect to the existing metal pipes and poly connectors to attach to any pvc/cpvc, PEX extensions, and fixture shut-off valves.
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