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cabin_pal
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# Posted: 5 Sep 2011 04:14pm
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Anyone have experience keeping rodents out of their wilderness abodes? My present cabin, built in the 1980's by someone else, has numerous gaps in the siding and floor boards, through which rodents of various descriptions gain access: mostly, mice and pack rats -- aka wood rats. The latter have little fear of people, will stare you down and, if cornered, have been known to attack. Fortunately, I've not been assaulted, yet, but I am getting tired of shewing-out and cleaning-up after these pests (I only visit the cabin 5-6 times a year, so they have ample opportunity to reset-up housekeeping).
Of course, the ultimate solution is to sheath and reside the cabin appropriately. I'm so rodent-paranoid now, though, that I fear the fury varmints will still find a way to gnaw back in to my cabin, when I'm not looking. At this point, I'm planning to staple 1/4"-grid hardware cloth to the undersides of the floor joists, and put 3" metal flashing around the cabin perimeter, where the newly mesh-covered joists meet the rim joists. Nearly 300 sq. ft. of hardware cloth will be expensive, but how else can rodents be deterred from chewing-in to a seldom occupied cabin? (I'm not into trapping or poisoning animals; they have as much right to live in the woods as I do. I suspect this particular cabin has had wood rat squatters, now, in excess of 30 years.)
Is my plan a good one: is it too costly, or appropriate to the situation? Anyone have rodent pest experiences similar to my own? Is there really such a thing as a rodent-proof cabin?
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 5 Sep 2011 06:22pm
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Zero issues. But I planned for this. I used a full footing/stemwall, no outside crawlspace (inside via trap door) and zero room where they can get in, includes even insect tight. I have every crack sealed. Unless they chew right through the siding, but its up high enough.
I think your plan is sound, metal is about the only thing. If you are on post, wrap them with sheet metal also, even if its just thin stove pipe, so they cant climb up them either.
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hattie
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# Posted: 5 Sep 2011 06:51pm
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The old timer who used to live here had a cabin. He had maybe a hundred tins from apple juice that were flattened out. He nailed these all along the bottom of his cabin to keep the vermin out and said it worked quite well.
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 5 Sep 2011 07:29pm
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Links to the National Park Service Rodent Exclusion Manual are found here
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Malamute
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# Posted: 5 Sep 2011 07:34pm
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I sympathise, I lived in a cabin that was a great mouse hotel, I never could keep them out. Someone else built it and didnt make it very tight.
You may be able to cover areas with metalic window screen also, but your hardware cloth will probably work.
I didnt mind trapping and shooting them. They had plenty of outdoors to live in without going in my cabin.
I haven't had any mice in any of the houses or cabins I've built. It isnt that hard to build tight.
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cabin_pal
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# Posted: 5 Sep 2011 08:30pm
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Thank you all for your comments. Yes, I know the ultimate solution is to build smart and tight, which is how I am inclined to build, anyway. I kind of inherited this problem from the cabin's original builder. He did some things right, as the cabin is still standing after 3+ decades; but he did some things horribly wrong, like taking-in the possibilities for rodent visitations.
Retrofitting this old cabin to be rodent-proof, now, will be a big job. I may still be up to it, but I recently decided to build a tight, tiny cabin to make my stays on the property comfortable, as I take-on the bigger task of rebuilding the older structure. I like my creature comforts (and don't want any other creatures to share them, except my dogs and human visitors). Thanks especially, MtnDon, for the links to the National Park Service Rodent Exclusion Manual. I didn't know such existed, and it looks to be exactly what the doctor ordered!
Any other rodent deterring ideas.... please continue to post them. Hopefully I'll be able to post some photos of the anti-rodent measures incorporated into my tiny cabin, once completed.
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steveqvs
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# Posted: 5 Sep 2011 10:01pm - Edited by: steveqvs
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I built and installed an Owl house. Unfortunately no owl moved in. I plan on building another this year. I think november is the time to have it up. Owls might be noisey but well worth what they eat in rodents. With our camper they seem to get in too! I think its really tough to keep them out of anywhere! We have put screen in places and used that expanding foam stuff too. Finding all the places will be hard. People with cabins in our area have them also.
But your plan of screen and sealing up is really the best plan!
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exsailor
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# Posted: 7 Sep 2011 03:50pm
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I have used this beiore in a shed. Stuff the outside openings with steel whool then a shot of expanding foamfrom the inside. The steel whool hurts their gums, so I am told, but they don't chew at it. The expanding foam seals the hole and back holds the steel whool. By the way mouse droppings can be nasty stuff or at least the dust off of it, so be careful cleaning. Good luck
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cabin_pal
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# Posted: 7 Sep 2011 11:24pm
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Steveqvs, thanks for your owl suggestion. I didn't know there was such a thing as an owl house. I'd be inclined to give the idea a try, except one of my two dogs is rather small and could just as well be an owl's prey as a rat. So I'll have to forego that idea. The main problem is that my cabin was built way too loose, and will need extensive rebuilding to be made rodent-proof. I do think small-grid hardware cloth across the floor joists will be part of the solution.
Hope your next owl house will attract a resident. If you haven't done so already, you might try using weathered (barn?) boards, and assembling with just nails and/or wooden pegs; no glue or paint. I've heard that odor from the latter two chemical agents tends to dissuade birds from nesting in freshly made houses, which otherwise may have to age a year or two to de-oderize sufficiently. Good luck!
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cabin_pal
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# Posted: 7 Sep 2011 11:41pm
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Exsailor, thank you for your comments. Yes, I've heard of the steel wool solution, but not backing it with foam. That's an approach I could take in a few places. The wood rats, though, are awfully aggressive and have powerful jaws.
Once, in replacing a board that had fallen off my cabin, I unknowingly trapped a rat in the walls. When I returned to the cabin a few weeks later, I discovered that the rat had gnawed its way to freedom through one-inch board. Such creatures may find steel wool a minor inconvenience, if they are set on gaining cabin access. A mouse: not so formidable a foe!
Thanks for the mouse droppings warning. I always wear a cartridge-style respirator when I sweep-up after the rodents. But the dust gets on your clothes, too; so I am always less-than-comfortable when it comes time to clean the cabin. Yours is a good warning to the wise.
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 8 Sep 2011 12:59am
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Hantavirus is the concern
Real bad $hit! The good news is that since '93 when NM had a large outbreak, the medical community here now knows a lot more about the virus. The fatality rate then was over 75% IIRC. It has now improved to only a 35% fatality rate. Yes 35%, still better than a 1 in 3 chance you will die. That may explain my obsession with rodent proofing. It is very important to get medical attention rapidly otherwise the virus overwhelms the body and your lungs fill with fluid and that's it.
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bobrok
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# Posted: 8 Sep 2011 01:24am
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Yowwww! So I should be very concerned if I find mouse droppings in my toilet paper holder in my outhouse??? Normally I would just brush them away.
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 8 Sep 2011 02:01am
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It's best to paint all the wood as that makes it easier to clean, IMO. A vacuum is a BAD thing to use as most will spew fine particles through the air from the bag. Google hantavirus, maybe add clean up or something. I know there are pages of info with clean up data as well as the dangers, etc out there on the web. The CDC has risk maps; some areas are hotter than others. Big hot spot is "the four corners", where NM, AZ, UT, CO meet, but almost all states and some provinces have risk, past cases. All you can do is try to discourage mice from gaining access. I've been 100% successful with our cabin but have had an issue with our shed. I have traps to keep the population down. Caught two at one time once; same trap. Peanut butter bait. Wish I had taken a picture.
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trollbridge
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# Posted: 8 Sep 2011 11:40am
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Oh yuck...I feel ill...
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cabin_pal
Member
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# Posted: 8 Sep 2011 01:52pm
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Guess I've been lucky not to have gotten sick in six years of sweeping up after rodents.... but I always do wear a canister-style respirator in the process, wait an hour or so before going back in the cabin (to let the dust settle), and stuff the clothes I was wearing into a sealed garbage bag, to thoroughly launder when I get back home. True: the best solution is to build tight to begin with, to minimize or eliminate rodent visitors and the cleaning headaches/health risks which come with them. (And to think that I had 21 pet gerbils at one time!)
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steveqvs
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# Posted: 12 Sep 2011 09:39pm
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Cabin pal,
I like the idea of old barn wood. I will look for some this year.
thanks
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bobrok
Member
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# Posted: 12 Sep 2011 09:59pm
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I have to believe that some people are just inherently hardier than others in that they can expose themselves to things that would make others keel over and that they do so without any effects. I have almost no allergies, am not affected by poison ivy, etc., while my buddy can't even make the car trip up my mountain road w/o getting car sick :(
I think I am a fortunate person.
Mouse droppings? No problems!
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holyoak2
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# Posted: 21 Sep 2011 07:08pm
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I have no problem with the animals outside, but when they start coming inside, I put my foot down. I use decon in places where the grandkids can't get into for the mouse types and that seems to solve the problem. I had rock chucks get into my roof once, and had to seal some holes up, but I found out that decon can help there also.
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mag162
Member
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# Posted: 23 Sep 2011 09:57am
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I plan on using 1/4 x 1/4 rabbit type fencing on the bottom of the cabin to keep them out of the place.
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cabin_pal
Member
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# Posted: 23 Sep 2011 03:57pm
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Yes, any grid opening size larger than 1/4" x 1/4" square would allow a mouse to squeeze through.
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bobrok
Member
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# Posted: 23 Sep 2011 11:29pm
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I have heard from oldtimers (and I'm 60, mind you) that mouse infestations occur roughly every 7 years, or somewhat in conjunction with certain species of tree and nut production coupled with weather, at least in the northeast where I am located. Last year we listened through the walls of our camp to the, ahem, amorous reproductive cycle of certain guests and we listened in awe to the newborn cries and maturation of said young.
This year...not a single peep. They're gone. Can anyone elaborate?
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brandywine
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# Posted: 11 Oct 2011 09:43pm
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Decon. You need to stop the generational memory of this family of rodents that have been taught the location of your cabin.
Once you kill all the routine visitors, you will only get the accidental visitor.
Also, try sprinkling fox/coyote urine (hunting cover scent) around your piers.
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cabin-pal
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# Posted: 12 Oct 2011 04:51am
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brandywine,
Hadn't heard of generational memory before, but I can see that this could be a big factor in my rodent problem. I've been putting out Decon in recent months, and it's definitely helping.
Where does one obtain fox or coyote urine?!!
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TWilliams
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# Posted: 13 Apr 2012 05:12pm
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Ive Just had to evict a pack rat from our shed. Boy did he make a mess!! chewed up all our camp chairs, our tool belts and anything with rubber on it. I was told by one of the old timers up at the lake that rodents dont like tar paper and they wont chew through it even though they could. So Im wrapping the interior and floor with tar paper and dropping a new floor in and walls.. that should keep em out.. I hope!
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tbjohn
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# Posted: 13 Apr 2012 06:15pm
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You might try the large pail or for rats a half barrel trap. Put a stick accross the center almost at the top with 2 screws so it can turn put peanut butter in the middle. They try and go out and wala ti spins and they fall in. I use boidegradable anitfreeze in the bottom. About 3". That way they do not rot and stick. I have gotton lots that way. Have one old camp that we had sometimes up to 15 at a time in. We would put the pail up real close to something like the woodpile so it was easy for them to get to. Works every time.
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