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Grizzlyman
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# Posted: 7 Jul 2024 10:34 - Edited by: Grizzlyman
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Kind of a weird one wondering if anyone had any thoughts?
We were up over the 4th for a long 8 night stay.
When we arrived I saw this: clearly, I have a leak somewhere around the chimney-and enough that water collected in the ash bucket.
HOWEVER- with this being the wettest spring/summer to date in MN- it did rain every single day we were there- including a 2”+ thunderstorm. Not a drop leaked in during this. It seems like a small leak- so I waited to inspect and wanted to see it in action- but it never leaked. I inspected eventually and nothing looked amiss. I didnt caulk anything yet- want to see it happen again.
This has not happened before in the 3 years I’ve had it.
Anyone have ANY idea what’s happening here? I did see some water marks on the roof around the chimney underneath.
There isn’t any additional surface rust on the black pipe-so my guess is it’s dripping down through the support box, over the double wall, and dripping down the double wall. Didn’t see water spots on the double wall though…so idk.
It seems to me that a leak should leak… so if it doesn’t I’m puzzled. Only thing I can think of is that maybe somehow driven rain gets up under the collar?… and even though we sat through one really hard rain it still wasn’t driven hard enough?
It’s a 6/12 steel roof so I doubt there’s any pooling issues… unless it’s somehow pooling on the boot over the chimney.
The boot is not tight on the chimney. The boot is tight on a spacer- which is then covered by a collar- this is the manufacturers design… I have written before about how poor the design is - but the fact is it hasn’t leaked before now.
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Grizzlyman
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# Posted: 7 Jul 2024 10:49 - Edited by: Grizzlyman
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Now that I think about it- it’s probably not the boot. Therer are water marks on the uphill side of the opening. I did not inspect the snow splitter above the chimney.
Being as the leak would have to be in the steel channel right above the chimney- that rules out anything else I can imagine. Maybe I forgot to silicone a hole or two from where I had to reinstall the splitter last year.
Still doesn’t explain why it’s didn’t leak when we were there though…
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FishHog
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# Posted: 7 Jul 2024 14:01
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From my experience trying to track down leaks in my steel roof I’m not going to be of much assistance.
Other than to say they can be frustrating and coming from farther away than expected
Good luck
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paulz
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# Posted: 7 Jul 2024 14:13
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A bit hard for me to understand your setup Griz, as I have an asphalt shingle roof and no box up there, but I sure do get the arriving to water on the stove top part.
Nothing really I can suggest other than spraying powdered something around to see if it gets wet or washed off. Or catch the guy that comes in and spills water while we’re gone.
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ICC
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# Posted: 7 Jul 2024 15:42
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I had a mystery leak with the cabin chimney shortly after I built it. Selkirk s/s chimney, ribbed metal roof, silicone boot. It never rained when we were at the cabin, but at times when we arrived there would be evidence that water had dribbled down onto the stove top.
That was finally traced to water leaking in at a exterior joint between the uppermost pipe section and the one below that it coupled to. Rain was entering that joint.Then I believe it ran down, inside the inner and outer skin, where the insulation is. Then it exited at the next lower coupling and ran down the outside of the lower pipe, dripping onto the stove top.
I only figured it put after siliconimg everything else and still having a leak I applied silicone to that joint in desperation. No more leak for 15 years.
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Grizzlyman
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# Posted: 7 Jul 2024 15:53
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ICC
Good suggestion. That was kind of my suggested fix… just silicone the heck out of everything!
But as far as the leak However with water staining on the roof sheathing I think it’s got to be water that is dripping in somewhere else and the running over the underlayment until it hits the hole where the chimney box is. It’s then running over and wetting the roof board as well as dripping probably on the outside of the cathedral support box. The cathedral box is entirely through the ceiling… so it’s got to be the outside of the box.
The chimney never touches the roof so could never wet the boards.
I can’t figure out though why it didn’t leak when we were there though. It’s possible that it always leaks… and that it’s just never noticeable until there enough rain… but man you think 2” in one t storm would do it.
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Grizzlyman
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# Posted: 7 Jul 2024 15:55
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And now that I think of it… it can’t be driven rain around the boot either because that would be inside the box… and that would never touch the boards.
Got to be the snow splitter… but still the question as to why it never showed up again puzzles me.
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 7 Jul 2024 17:45
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Now that all the wood under the roof leak has swelled up it stopped the leak?
Still begs the question, where is the leak.....
I had similar at our old shack with a metal roof just once (though not at any roof breach). There was a big rain when we weren't there, came and found some water, so I pulled stuff away and put a bucket under. Nothing ever came in there again.
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 7 Jul 2024 20:35
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Do you have exposed fasterners? If so, check them to see if they are tight. They will loosen as the metal heats and cools, it loosens screws. As for your snow splitter, use membrane under it, screw splitter on top of membrane, will never leak again.
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Grizzlyman
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# Posted: 9 Jul 2024 00:07
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toyota_mdt_tech
Good suggestion. Yes- for the roof they are the typical steel roofing screws with a washer. I will check the screws next time. also great idea about the membrane below the splitter
I did beef up the screws to larger structural screws for the splitter and chimney supports after the snow/ice sheered them off the previous year. I siliconed them all before drilling and after though. Perhaps that opened up and is where the leak is…
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Brettny
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# Posted: 9 Jul 2024 09:56
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I also had a leak, a rust stain the size of a half dollar on my stove top. Right after I put the chimney in. I sealed up everything again with Lexal. No more leaks.
You really need to get on the roof and look with a fine tooth comb. Leaks dont happen on the Inside.
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Grizzlyman
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# Posted: 9 Jul 2024 17:04 - Edited by: Grizzlyman
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My primary concern is the intermittent nature of the leak. I can certainly troubleshoot and inspect the roof… but I guess I am mainly wondering why it would be intermittent and anyone has any experience with any intermittent leaks like this.
I suspect it would have to be a significant leak to fill up the bucket like that… so it doesn’t seem that a small leak like a screw hole could be causing it but seeing no leaks after a week of rain make me curious… I just don’t know.
The other thought I had is driven rain up underneath the ridge cap that rolls down the underlayment and comes out through the chimney hole. That would mean that the driven rain is likely driven under the whole roof but is only contacting the actual sheathing where there’s a hole in the underlayment… aka the chimney. This seems more plausible to me. And I don’t think we had a real serious driven rain in our storms when there last week.
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FishHog
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# Posted: 11 Jul 2024 12:01
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My intermittent leaks have all been from driving rain and it’s hard to replicate those exact conditions
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Grizzlyman
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# Posted: 12 Jul 2024 13:31
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FishHog
That’s what I’m thinking. Do you know where it’s come in in those circumstances?
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Tim_Ohio
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# Posted: 12 Jul 2024 13:47
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Grizzlyman,
Can you post a picture of the roof installation? I think seeing the installation from different angles/views at the roof would be useful.
Tim
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Grizzlyman
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# Posted: 14 Jul 2024 17:37
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Quick trip this weekend.no sign of anything leaking.
I think I’ll just chalk this up to some very driven rain and a not very common occurrence. I wil go up to the roof some other time with a tube of silicone and silicone the heck out of everthing just for good measure. I think I should wedge another foam closure strip in the top as well ( at least uproof from the chimney) to stop driven rain from possibly going in under the roof cap.
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