Regulating rainwater barrels in the dry western U.S.

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Small Cabin Forum / General Forum / Regulating rainwater barrels in the dry western U.S.


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Steve_S Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 08:41am Reply I came across this article today & thought I should share it with the folks here. This is of particular interest to those in California, Colorado, Texas etc where droughts are ongoing and the various states are attempting to control Rainwater Capture. Why it makes little sense to regulate rainwater barrels in the dry western U.S.

bldginsp Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 12:19pm Reply Chapter 457 of Western Water Wars. It seems ridiculous to regulate water collection off of roofs, but then there was the guy who dammed up his seasonal stream and claimed that he was doing 'rainwater collection', depriving those downstream of him of water that ran every year in the stream. But regulating water that comes out of the sky onto your roof is, well, over the line as far as I'm concerned.

offgridjunkie Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 12:35pm Reply Quoting: bldginsp It seems ridiculous to regulate water collection off of roofs, but then there was the guy who dammed up his seasonal stream and claimed that he was doing 'rainwater collection', depriving those downstream of him of water that ran every year in the stream. Yeah, I did this this summer, but I convinced a family of beavers to move in . They build 6 dams on my creek, made a huge mess, cut down trees and muddied my watter. Neighbors down stream thought I did it - ha there is no way I have the skills those beavers have. Now have 6 large beaver ponds - and they ruined my fav. swimming hole.

Steve_S Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 01:28pm Reply Quoting: bldginsp But regulating water that comes out of the sky onto your roof is, well, over the line as far as I'm concerned. 100% agreed ! govern-MENTAL mediocrity at work.

MtnDon Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 02:24pm Reply Quoting: Steve_S Quoting: bldginsp But regulating water that comes out of the sky onto your roof is, well, over the line as far as I'm concerned. 100% agreed ! govern-MENTAL mediocrity at work. However, for example, a resident of TX who depends on the water flowing from my home in NM via the Rio Grande would argue that removal and storage of water from the natural system is not right either. Water removed and stored will never make its way downstream. There are inter state agreements as to how much water must pass through to TX. There is no simple answer and it gets more complicated when the snows and rains slow or fail for extended periods. At least 2 sides to every question.

Steve_S Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 02:43pm Reply Well, I'm thinking of what comes off my roof specifically... Not streams, creeks or such. That's quite another matter depending on the region and it's situation. I think if it's off the roof and saved, it will be returned to the land either by use in gardens, lawns or other means. How much would the average person / family "capture" anyways ? I suppose if you had a massive roof, like a big barn or something you could capture a lot of rainwater but in the grand scheme of things I still don't see it as that significant overall. Luckily, I live in an area unaffected by such things, so my perspective is such.

bldginsp Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 04:31pm Reply Quoting: MtnDon Water removed and stored will never make its way downstream. That's a blanket statement. At the moment, I use collected rainwater to charge a toilet and for a shower, both of which drain to a septic system which puts the water into the earth, though somewhat later than it would have gone originally. It does get more complicated the more you look at it, though. They want to tax wells here in California. What? Tax my damn well water? Well, (pardon the pun) look at this scenario- a resident in a farming area near me had his well run dry, because the farmers were pumping so much water that the water table dropped. Do they have the right to do that? What do you do about it? Tax the farmers to pay for residential wells?

Julie2Oregon Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 04:49pm Reply Let me get this straight. To protect the water supply, you're going to target the people who are off-grid or at least trying to reduce their consumption of water by using rain barrels? LOL. These are the folks who are likely the most mindful of conserving water, as opposed to people in the urban areas and suburbia who simply turn on their taps and sprinklers without a thought. Yep, groundwater is a troublesome issue and likely to get worse but instead of going after the wrong people, how about implementing some REAL solutions? Widespread greywater filtering and reuse, waterless toilets, upgraded and improved septic codes allowing new products that ARE out there and used in other countries? It blew my mind how we were in an historic drought with reservoirs down to dangerous levels and lakes drying up but the city in Texas where I live was STILL watering all of the grass and landscaping like mad with sprinklers that throw water all over the sidewalks and road. We don't like to change here in the US when it comes to things like this or, Heaven forbid, have to think about unpleasant things in new ways. We'd rather find a small group or person to blame and then go merrily along.

toyota_mdt_tech Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 05:04pm Reply Julie, the way I look at it, you collecting the water isn't taking it from the supply, just delaying it. I certainly wouldn't run to a planning dept and tell anyone. I'd just do it until told otherwise. Maybe set up a prop hand well etc for the inspector etc. Caution, sunlight will be next. (I am serious, don't doubt me)

Julie2Oregon Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 05:42pm Reply toyota_mdt_tech Oh, it's all good in Oregon for me regarding rainwater collection, solar panels, my compost toilet, greywater system, etc. But if they can make a buck off you in Texas, oh, they'll find a way. See, Texas is sneaky. They privatize all of the crap so they can claim the state has low taxes and fees when it really doesn't. And the politicians farm out these fee collection contracts to their buddies in business. Free enterprise/capitalism at its finest. I get constant door-to-door and mail solicitation from electric companies, septic line warranty companies, you name it, because so much is deregulated or privatized and our names and residential info are sold to these cmpanies. Ticks me off. Since they deregulated electric, you have to sign contracts with an electric company to get decent rates. So now I have to find a way out of my contract since I'm moving to avoid the penalty fees, sigh.

bldginsp Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 07:07pm - Edited by: bldginsp Reply Quoting: toyota_mdt_tech sunlight will be next Already is. In Spain you are taxed for solar production http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/articles/2015/10/spain-approves-sun-tax-discrimin ates-against-solar-pv.html

KinAlberta Member	# Posted: 25 Mar 2016 07:40pm Reply Sounds like a business opportunity to sell camouflaged rain barrels.

Jebediah Member	# Posted: 26 Mar 2016 07:14pm - Edited by: Jebediah Reply Nova Scotia (Halifax region) we are now being charged/taxed for having waste water(runoff) flowing into our drains.

MtnDon Member	# Posted: 26 Mar 2016 07:36pm Reply Quoting: Jebediah Nova Scotia (Halifax region) we are now being charged/taxed for having waste water(runoff) flowing into our drains ...do you mean surface water running into sewagedrains?

Jebediah Member	# Posted: 26 Mar 2016 08:52pm Reply Quoting: MtnDon do you mean surface water running into sewagedrains Yes, surface water running into our street catch basins. I think its an additional 10.00 on our water bills. The city just put this in place about a year ago.

Julie2Oregon Member	# Posted: 26 Mar 2016 11:23pm Reply Well, that stinks. How do that know you DO have surface water runoff from your house? I'd tell them they could stuff their fee because I use drip irrigation for my landscaping and take my car to the car wash. And they're welcome to monitor. But that's typical me, lol.

Jebediah Member	# Posted: 27 Mar 2016 06:36am Reply Quoting: Julie2Oregon How do that know you DO have surface water runoff from your house I wasn't around when all the bickering was going on, but I know people were complaining about it. The city said that there is so much run off that its actually costing them money to get 'rid' of it and the current system can't keep up. They charge everyone a flat rate. I'm not sure if houses with ditches are being charged this fee. I thought it would be a subject worth mentioning in this forum.

ChuckDynasty Member	# Posted: 30 Mar 2016 01:52pm Reply Really unbelievable especially when you read this. http://www.cnbc.com/2016/01/15/saudi-arabia-buying-up-farmland-in-us-southwest.html

Steve_S Member	# Posted: 30 Mar 2016 02:22pm Reply That was bad enough in January and 2 days ago this appeared Why-Saudi-Arabia-bought-14-000-acres-of-US-farm-land and how they are connecting the land for the water rights & access. In the 90's the water barons started the game and it's evolved into privatization-of-water-as-an-owned-commodity-rather-than-a-universal-human-right. Sadly, it doesn't seem like anything will improve for John & Jane Public and in the long term as water resources get more scarce, things don't bode well.