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2Dogs
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# Posted: 31 Oct 2010 05:39pm
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New guy here.
Moving to a remote location in the near future. Off grid most likely. My plan is to use a small 12v freezer(1.8 cu ft) to store a small amount of frozen food but mostly use it to make ice for a max cold type seven day ice chest that will act as my refrigerator.
Anyone ever try this? Anyone see a problem with my idea?
Thanks.
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tony
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# Posted: 31 Oct 2010 06:36pm
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Can you give more details on the freezer?
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 31 Oct 2010 07:45pm
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Yes, details like the manufacturers estimated power use or the operating amps, name, etc.
Does it use a compressor like a Danfoss (very good) or is it a peltier effect like a Koolatron (power hungry)
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2Dogs
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# Posted: 31 Oct 2010 08:09pm - Edited by: 2Dogs
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Here it is.
http://www.bensdiscountsupply.com/sundanzer50l50litreliter18cubicfootrefrigeratororfr eezer.aspx
The interior measurements tell me I can get twelve two liter pop bottles in it. Not that I think I would need all that ice to keep the ice chest cold.
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 31 Oct 2010 08:35pm
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The premise works. I have a friend who travels the desert a lot on extended camping trips. He uses an ARB freezer (12 VDC Danfoss compressor like the Sundanzer) to make ice that he uses in one or two 'extreme' coolers for food and drink.
Your plan would mean no long absences from maintaining the ice supply in the food coolers.
One reason the Sundanzer is miserly on power is the chest design, better than an upright. Some folks find the chest a drag after a while, or so I've heard from one user of a Sundanzer refrigerator.
SunDanzer Solar Powered Refrigerator/Freezer - Cheaper here
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2Dogs
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# Posted: 31 Oct 2010 08:50pm - Edited by: 2Dogs
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That sounds great Don. That solves one problem.
I'm planning on selling my house and living in the shack I build so I will be around to add ice as necessary.
Book marked the site you posted Don. Thanks.
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PlicketyCat
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# Posted: 18 Dec 2010 06:00am
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2Dogs - we have the Sundanzer 5.8 cu ft freezer hooked up to the battery array (and eventually it's own dedicated 75w panel) and we use it to freeze portion sizes of highly perishable stuff and to make ice for our cooler that acts as our summer refrigerator.
We did it all this summer and it work perfectly. We used a dozen of the blue ices and traded 6 of them out every couple of days. 2 liter bottles would probably work as well, but you might want to try smaller bottles and distribute them more evenly through the cooler... that way your yogurt in the middle won't freeze to the ice block while the butter on the edges starts getting soft.
We also froze the 20 oz water bottles to take with us out working in the heat, they'd slowly melt during the day and we'd get cold water. I can't tell you how many times that saved us from heat exhaustion. Plus filling up the extra space in the freezer with pop bottles helps keep it colder and use less power.
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larryh
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2010 09:30pm - Edited by: larryh
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Among the many things I am interested in is Ice Refrigerators. Granted I live on power and have been making my own larger ice blocks from a upright freezer that keeps ahead of my late model Coolerator Ice Box I restored from a wreck. This time of year it runs for usually 6 days on the four blocks I make for it. I have always wanted to find or create a smaller more efficient box just to see if I could get one to run longer cooling a smaller area and using less ice. I have about 50 of those blue ice blocks I purchased thinking at one point they would be a good way to cool without a drain pan. But what I found was that real ice blocks drop the temperature by about 5 or more degrees than the blue ice ones. I think its the vinyl cover that stops some of the cold transmission? I am going to post a photo here of the finished coolerator, I don't have a photo of the ice compartment with the large blocks, only one with a small set I was making mostly melted but will put it up as it shows the interior. It maintains below 40 most of the time due to a cooling grid they developed. The air always flows below the ice never above it like other ice boxes usually did.
In cold climates it would be a snap to freeze the same containers I am currently using outside and one could have a reasonably large refrigerator to use in winter if you needed it. I used to set containers out to freeze and then try to store them but it never worked well because our climate isn't a cold as farther north. I visited some Amish in Michigan and they still had a large stock of ice in a ice house they had built the year before. It had a fair sized stack of ice in late August. Of course they have help and cut the blocks from a local pond. Most amish that still cool with ice use freezers and the temperature is never as cool as a real ice box would create, but they probably get more length of time from a block due to the top opening lid.
I am surprised you all are able to get that solar powered freezer to create much ice. I had a propane freezer at one time and it was painfully slow freezing any kind of quantity and never would have kept up with this coolerator.
Coolerator 1938 Ice Box.
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Coolerator interior with small pieces of ice.
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hattie
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2010 09:51pm - Edited by: hattie
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Between 1940 and 1965 our town had no electricity. The locals used to cut ice blocks from the local lake and store them in ice houses. The ice was then covered with straw and they say it stayed frozen all year. It was also common to build root cellars into the banks of hills and supposedly that was also a good way to keep things cold. I have heard some people kept food in their wells to keep it chilled.
I love the photos of the old ice box you have posted.
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larryh
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2010 10:47pm
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Hattie,
The amish I visited use a new system which is many ways is better than the old. Instead of burying the ice in sawdust or straw as was common in the past they now built it with thick styrofoam insulation, a gravel floor to drain the water with a plank wood open flooring to hold the ice which is stacked in a big block in the house. No mess. Of course you need to be able to get the blocks cut properly or they aren't going to stack. That was one thing I ran into freezing pans in the yard or the freezer, they don't end up level, they tend to hump on the bottom or/and tops making them not level to stack. I need to get a photo when I put the new ice in the box, it looks a lot neater with it full. I had to completely create new feet for this one, they were rusted off and the fellow that had it had welded huge iron bars on it o make it stand up. That was quite a challenge. Your looking at a month and a half of work to get it to look like that. Tons of dents, falling off doors, bad insulation, your get the picture, lots of rust.
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hattie
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2010 11:29pm
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Quoting: larryh I had to completely create new feet for this one, they were rusted off and the fellow that had it had welded huge iron bars on it o make it stand up. That was quite a challenge. Your looking at a month and a half of work to get it to look like that. Tons of dents, falling off doors, bad insulation, your get the picture, lots of rust.
WOW you have done a fantastic job! You would never know the ice box was rusty before and has new feet on it now. Beautiful!!!
The Amish are an amazing group of people aren't they? What a great idea about using the styrofoam and a gravel floor with plank boards. I would imagine this works much better and is much cleaner then using straw or sawdust. It is too bad you can't get the Amish to supply you with blocks of ice. For many years, the ice from the local lake was shipped to the States on trains to be used in ice houses there.
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PlicketyCat
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# Posted: 21 Dec 2010 01:30am - Edited by: PlicketyCat
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Quoting: larryh I am surprised you all are able to get that solar powered freezer to create much ice. I had a propane freezer at one time and it was painfully slow freezing any kind of quantity and never would have kept up with this coolerator.
We actually found that super-hi-efficiency off-grid electrical units got about 10-15 degrees colder than the propane and kerosene freezers and refrigerators, the temps stayed more even througout the entire box, and they stayed colder longer. We could run the freezer off a single 12v with a max of 2 gallon a week of gas ($40/mo); but the same size propane unit was going through a 20# bottle every 5 days ($60/mo), and kerosene was about a gallon a day ($300/mo for K-1!!!).
The chest design definitely makes a difference, as does keeping it as far from any heating device as possible... we keep ours outside on the north porch since it only gets 60-65 in the shade. We had the dial turned to medium on the SunDanzer to keep it at -10, we only turn it down to high for a few hours when we'd pack a hundred lbs of meat in there all at once to freeze up.
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PlicketyCat
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# Posted: 21 Dec 2010 01:40am
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Quoting: larryh That was one thing I ran into freezing pans in the yard or the freezer, they don't end up level, they tend to hump on the bottom or/and tops making them not level to stack.
Try using a draw shave to take off the humps, that's what we use to knock down the ripples from our creek ice. Another thing that seemed to work was using a tub with a slight raised center, like a tote, I guess since it was shallower in the middle that evened out the temperature so it froze the same instead of the center freezing last and pushing up.
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larryh
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# Posted: 21 Dec 2010 08:17am
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I love these pre power items and always have. Something about saving something that is mostly unwanted and restoring it to new usable condition has provided med with a lot of satisfaction. We have a local museum that I donated a large restored kerosene cooking range to, they would like to have a ice refrigerator for their historic rooms they plan to set up eventually. I have a couple I have redone also sitting next door in my moms basement. I may have to donate one of them, but for now this Coolerator is one I always wanted but could never find a restorable one around here. An amish fellow I knew had this one in a storage shed and I had seen it, but not quite all of it. After 15 years he decided to trade me for a little kerosene cook stove I had he wanted. When we pulled it out of the shed it became obvious the legs had been in some very damp locations for along time. I almost threw it away, but liking a challenge I decided to go ahead and try to restore it. I am glad I did now.
Legs with welded bar for support. Had to cut them off just below the curve in the body.
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Wood lower structure replacing bad legs.
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New metal skin over shimmed wood to level it out with top skin.
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Showing the condition of the water pan removal door before rebuilding them with metal and body putty
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