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Bridge Boy
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2011 01:04pm
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I have five year old camp that has 3/4 inch foam insulation for floor insulation. Floor joist I believe are 2X8's on 24" centers. Felt paper under sub floor. I need to make changes as I am there when below zero. Floor joist are 3 feet from ground on piers.
I am trying to decide if I should use R 30 unfaced and enclose bottom of camp with the 7/16 OSB sheets that Home Depot sells.
My other choice is 2" foam (doubled) and use the OSB sheets.
What would you suggest and and also should I use pneumatic staples
to fasten sheathing to floor joist? Mice and squirrels can be a concern so I wanted bottom enclosed.
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bobrok
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2011 02:24pm - Edited by: bobrok
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Hi Bridge Boy,
I have 2" foam boards and my floors are still rather cold. I am thinking of enclosing the bottom with fiberglass as you are. There is quite a difference in R-value between the two.
In my house I have done the fiberglass between the floor joists over an unheated crawl space. Big difference with vs. without the fiberglass and I am sure it would show up at camp as well although may not be as pronounced as one is indoors and the other outdoors.
Nevertheless I would advise you not to waste your time and money wth the 2" foam.
P.S.: I am in Upstate NY also so we are talking about the same type of outdoor temperatures.
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MikeOnBike
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2011 04:56pm
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I used 2" foam for the small cabin/shed that we built last summer. At only 120sqft it wasn't a lot of cost over fiberglass and OSB. Given my timing I knew it would get wet before I could get a roof up and I only need R10 or so.
For anything other than those conditions I would/will go R30 or whatever the joist will hold and cover with OSB/plywood.
This spring I'll know if the pack rats like the taste of Owens Corning Foamular 150 or not. If they do I'll have to cover the bottom.
If you have a 2x8 floor you will have to compress the 9-1/2" R30 batts by two inches and that will reduce the R value down to R-25. If cost is an issue you might be just as well off to put in R-19 or use R21 if you can get it for a cheaper price than the R-30.
Compression Chart
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Borrego
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2011 09:27pm
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I covered the bottom of my desert cabin floor with 1/4" luan. It has 2x10 joists at 24" OC. I attached them with 8d's and sealed all gaps with either silicone or foam......
I was able to do some of mine from beneath as it is quicker, but where I couldn't get under neath i did it from above.
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Just
Member
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# Posted: 17 Feb 2011 07:15pm
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no matter what you insulate with i would cover it with alumium sheeting ..porkies love the glue in any kind of plywood!!!!
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Just
Member
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# Posted: 17 Feb 2011 07:34pm
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p.s. do not use" luan " i think it is porkypine 's favorite food!!!
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turkeyhunter
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# Posted: 17 Feb 2011 08:09pm
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we have no porkypines........here in the south , but we have arm-a-dildo's..........which are a pain...burrowing under my camp..............bump in the middle of the night..........
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bobrok
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# Posted: 18 Feb 2011 07:59am
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Anyone have any thoughts on using wire mesh screen to protect and support the fiberglass? It would seem a lot easier to fit and install vs. wrangling sheets of rigid material.
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rayyy
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# Posted: 19 Feb 2011 10:54am
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Thicker is better so I'd go with the fiberglass and OSB.You can't rule out mice,rats and red squirrels and chipmunks though.They don't take no for an answer.It's also true that in the southern tier (new york) porccupines can chew your cabin right out from under you.Everybody has to shroud everything in metal flashing at the ground level.Red squirrels can chew there way into your cabin in about 20 minuits.There is no easy answer to combat them.
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larryh
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# Posted: 20 Feb 2011 10:57pm
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I had a skunk to get under a rear room of my house that had an open access, he pulled down quite a bit of the 6" fiberglass insulation I had under the flooring. If your going to use that product be prepared to protect it well.
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GoinToClarksville
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# Posted: 13 Mar 2011 05:24pm
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So is there a correct or proper way to insulate the floor of a cabin....given all the little critters around? I'm in Western New York and have issues with mice getting into the cabin. I have had squirrels chew holes into the cabin and access that way. I'm wondering if there is spray or some sort of non-leathal way to keep them away....nothing likr showing up for the weekend and ya have to whipe and disenfect counters, floors and bedding....perhaps a fake owl on a table when I leave....scare the little buggers!
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Bridge Boy
Member
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# Posted: 13 Mar 2011 07:59pm
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Hi,
I just priced some 15/32 CDX plywood for $11.97 a sheet. I am thinking of using this instead of the OSB board which is about $7.00 a sheet. A little apprehensive about OSB. I plan on using R 30 unfaced insulation between floor joist.
I think an 18 gage 1 1/2" crown staple will work to fasten this sheathing to the bottom of floor joist? Any advice?
Bridge Boy
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larry
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# Posted: 13 Mar 2011 10:15pm
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in all seriousness has anyone had success in protecting the bottom of there cabin from critters? i plan on insulating my floor with fiberglass this spring and we have all the aforementioned critters here in Michigan,except for arm-a-dildos. what i don't want to do is to make a Hilton for all the rodent in the forest. i would love to here from anyone who has had long term success
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Just
Member
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# Posted: 13 Mar 2011 10:22pm
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not i .. we's got weasels
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 13 Mar 2011 10:51pm - Edited by: MtnDon
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3/8" CDX secured with air gun nails under the joists, except for a few "inspection" panels that are screwed in place. All panel seams are flush, tight and smooth like a floor.
A 4 inch vent strip along the inside of each lengthwise girder. Aluminum insect screen and then 1/4" hardware cloth protect the vent opening. Wood stove fresh air intake protected with double layer 1/4" hardware cloth. Ditto on the bathroom vent stack and the propane refrigerator air inlet and exhaust. The door has tight weather striping and dual door sweeps. No cracks for rodents to get through.
The few pipe and electrical pipe.conduit access openings are either fitted to a tight push through clearance or if they were larger to begin with they are sealed with a steel wool and cement mortar mix, covered by paintable caulk.
Cabin underside is open, no corners or niches for critters to take shelter.
Soffit vents are too smaller for rodents and aluminum screened against insects. Gable vents are aluminum insect and 1/4" hardware cloth covered.
No trace of insects invasions.
No trace of rodent invasions.
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Martian
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# Posted: 14 Mar 2011 07:50pm
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Quoting: larry in all seriousness has anyone had success in protecting the bottom of there cabin from critters?
I can tell you that window screen doesn't work! I will use 1/2" hail screen next time. I thought about bending 24" flashing and putting it between the joist before decking the floor, but then I figured I need to vent the space; so hence the hail screen.
Tom
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 14 Mar 2011 11:52pm
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Half inch square holes are large enough for deer mice to squeeze through. Use 1/4 inch, welded, heaviest wire you can get. The insect screen I used in conjunction with the 1/4 inch hardware is for insects and it is on the other side of the 1/4 mesh as seen from the rodents point of view.
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Martian
Member
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# Posted: 15 Mar 2011 08:00am
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Good idea, Don. Thanks.
Tom
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honusbam
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# Posted: 30 Mar 2011 10:54pm
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Quoting: larry in all seriousness has anyone had success in protecting the bottom of there cabin from critters
In a cabin where these critters have an abundance of un-disturbed time to work their way in, I would say that metal (aluminum) is going to be about the only sure-fire way to keep them out, and even then make sure things are tight!
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brianmmmmm
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# Posted: 5 Nov 2012 12:23pm
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I am in canada niagara on the lake. I did 4" of gravel on ground, vapour barrier then 2" of gravel on top of vapor barrier. Then pressure treated joists 2x8 with 6" squares of pt 1/2 plywood screwed to 8' joists every 2ft, then flip joists upside down so pt plywood is on bottom and cut 14" x 8' long pices of pt plywood and drop into spaces between joists. and screw to 6x6 pieces with drywall screws. Then drop in 2 layers of 3.5" fiberglass, removing vapor from bottom piece. then vapour on top and 3/4 plywood screwed. so get R26 and bottom of cottage is all pt plywood and pt joist ends. Put home depot sonic 120v critter rids in the gravel and pt crawl space. should work.
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tcmatt
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# Posted: 5 Nov 2012 08:46pm
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I'm probably going to be made fun of here, but....
How big is the cabin and what is issue you're trying to prevent? Cold feet or major heat loss? if its a small cabin and the only worry is a cold floor/feet - wool socks and crocs are a great, cheap solution. I work in my garage (concrete slab) in northern michigan in the dead of winter and my feet never get cold in crocs (closed-cell foam). I have a 12x16 on piers with an uninsulated floor and so far, the wool socks and crocs are doing the trick there, as well.
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winter
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# Posted: 28 Dec 2012 05:32pm
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I'm in Nova Scotia. My building is 12x16 also, also uninsulated under floor but am thinking poly under closed cell foam sheets inside under the flooring. More concerned with heat loss than cold feet. A bucket of crocs by the door sounds good.
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UpstateNYADK
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# Posted: 4 Jan 2013 08:58am
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We have spray foam in the crawl space under the cabin. Keeps it insulated, and keeps the creepy crawling things out...
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bobbotron
Member
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# Posted: 4 Jan 2013 01:41pm
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You could use mineral wool batts, they come in 24" OC batts, and are more rodent proof. More $$, but not shockingly so. It's also nicer to install than pink fibreglass. We're going to use this stuff for our cabin floor...
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lex
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# Posted: 16 Sep 2015 04:05pm
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I finally replaced the rigid foam sheets with r30 and then closed it all up with 1 "foil backed insulated sheets. It kept almost all the mice out, save for one area where the drain is.
In the catskills, my mice *love* to eat insulation and spray foam they can (and have) also easily chew through all but the toughest screen.
I may cover more with hardy backer or some other lower priced sheathing.
I will say once the floor was properly insulated, it made a huge difference, floor is no longer cold at all which makes my cabin feel warmer.
Good luck with your project.
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etkeeney
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# Posted: 20 Aug 2016 11:45am
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What did you do under the R-10 for the subfloor? Some kind of vapor barrier - or is there nothing between R-10 and the earth?
Thx!
E
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DRR
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# Posted: 20 Aug 2016 03:45pm - Edited by: DRR
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The wire mesh has worked for me in MT. Going on two years. My neighbors put it in for me. Top notch friends. I owe them lots of beer for a while.
So far it's kept out all the critters. But we also don't have armadillos...LOL!
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toyota_mdt_tech
Member
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# Posted: 22 Aug 2016 10:37am
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Use what DDR has, looks like the 1/4" galvie mesh, no varmints getting through this.
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smallcabin
Member
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# Posted: 22 Aug 2016 03:56pm
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Have you tried using 22 or .17 varmint deterrent? I heard they make great snack on a spit? LOL
Quoting: rayyy Thicker is better so I'd go with the fiberglass and OSB.You can't rule out mice,rats and red squirrels and chipmunks though.They don't take no for an answer.It's also true that in the southern tier (new york) porccupines can chew your cabin right out from under you.Everybody has to shroud everything in metal flashing at the ground level.Red squirrels can chew there way into your cabin in about 20 minuits. There is no easy answer to combat them.
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DRR
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# Posted: 23 Aug 2016 12:45am
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Yes Sir Toyota. Some good stuff. The pics are before it was completely covered. Gotta make sure to cover every nook and cranny. So far, so good...knock on wood.
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